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MARTIN PIPE Conditionals Handicap Hurdle

Ash Tree Meadow entered to run this Thursday 10th Feb at Thurles at 3.30 pm. Decs tomorrow for the race.
 
ComplyOrDie said:
I've added a further 4pts E/W on Hollow Games after them ratings. Don't see how he can get UK Tax of 8lbs based on what he's achieved, tbh. Even if he ends up top weight he'll have one of the better conditionals on board, which will count for a fair bit.
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Is that with NRNB concession?
 
ComplyOrDie said:
Yeah. 10/1 with Hills.
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With the concession I’d be interested at that price. I’m of the opinion he’ll still go the open route but NRNB takes away that risk (just tied up cash).
 
JackieMoon33 said:
With the concession I’d be interested at that price. I’m of the opinion he’ll still go the open route but NRNB takes away that risk (just tied up cash).
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Yeah, I mean I had a small punt at 14's without the concession and without knowing his mark, and was surprised he's been dropped 2lbs off the back of the 3rd in the Nathaniel Lacy, however I can't see a way the handicapper can justify 8lbs tax for him so he'll likely get a run. Once that mark came out it was a no brainer for me NRNB.

I think this is his optimum trip, personally. The one issue may be that Grand Jury has the same rating in Ireland and holds Hollow Games based on the Lawlors Of Naas run, so may need to cover him as well.
 
ComplyOrDie said:
Yeah, I mean I had a small punt at 14's without the concession and without knowing his mark, and was surprised he's been dropped 2lbs off the back of the 3rd in the Nathaniel Lacy, however I can't see a way the handicapper can justify 8lbs tax for him so he'll likely get a run. Once that mark came out it was a no brainer for me NRNB.

I think this is his optimum trip, personally. The one issue may be that Grand Jury has the same rating in Ireland and holds Hollow Games based on the Lawlors Of Naas run, so may need to cover him as well.
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I’d still be surprised if Hollow Games doesn’t run in either of the open races as they’ve not campaigned him with handicaps in mind. He’s also been running on merit as opposed to hiding himself in graded races. He’d still be a place contender on known form and we don’t know if the step up to 3 could bring out some improvement. It also looks like Gordon has a good few that have been campaigned for handicaps and will be more well in for this (including for same connections).
 
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JackieMoon33 said:
I’d still be surprised if Hollow Games doesn’t run in either of the open races as they’ve not campaigned him with handicaps in mind. He’s also been running on merit as opposed to hiding himself in graded races. He’d still be a place contender on known form and we don’t know if the step up to 3 could bring out some improvement. It also looks like Gordon has a good few that have been campaigned for handicaps and will be more well in for this (including for same connections).
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I think he'd get done by a few in the Bartlett, personally.

Ginto keeps drifting for the Ballymore, again today as well, suggesting he will go for the Bartlett (which he is favourite for) and connections have already said only one of them will run in the race. I think they'll have the Pipe in mind for HG, personally, given he is now held by a few in the Bartlett on bare form.

I don't buy the theory of him needing a step up in trip, as I've mentioned a few times, possibly in debate with your good self, that I think his optimum trip is the intermediate one.
 
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ComplyOrDie said:
I think he'd get done by a few in the Bartlett, personally.

Ginto keeps drifting for the Ballymore, again today as well, suggesting he will go for the Bartlett (which he is favourite for) and connections have already said only one of them will run in the race. I think they'll have the Pipe in mind for HG, personally, given he is now held by a few in the Bartlett on bare form.

I don't buy the theory of him needing a step up in trip, as I've mentioned a few times, possibly in debate with your good self, that I think his optimum trip is the intermediate one.
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I’m not sure what his trip is as he’s not managed to win those graded races and has finished in similar positions each time against different opposition. I think it’s more ability, and he’s not quite top of the tree over hurdles.
 
JackieMoon33 said:
I’m not sure what his trip is as he’s not managed to win those graded races and has finished in similar positions each time against different opposition. I think it’s more ability, and he’s not quite top of the tree over hurdles.
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Yeah, I'd agree, he's probably just off G1 level, certainly what his performances have suggested this season :encouragement:
 
The more I see hollow games run the more I just dont think hes a grade 1 standard horse

Kinda reminds me of stattler last season

Iv got nice prices on him but I'd be pretty surprised if he won at this stage
 
JackieMoon33 said:
I’d still be surprised if Hollow Games doesn’t run in either of the open races as they’ve not campaigned him with handicaps in mind. He’s also been running on merit as opposed to hiding himself in graded races. He’d still be a place contender on known form and we don’t know if the step up to 3 could bring out some improvement. It also looks like Gordon has a good few that have been campaigned for handicaps and will be more well in for this (including for same connections).
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It's a fair response and I agree he's been campaigned with lets see how good you are but now he's ended up on 138 you couldn't fault them entering him in hcaps as if it where to be a soft ground fez for example you'd expect him to be very competitive in a handicap around the 143 mark dare I say like another expensive Gordy horse who didn't quite live up to what was expected from his bumper runs.... Blow By Blow.
 
This is pretty much why I take the view I do about first season novices being allowed to compete in the handicaps.
Hollow Games has been talked all season about being an Albert Bartlett horse, capable of winning a G1 festival novice hurdle, but when the handicapper issues a mark like that you can see why heads might get turned to handicaps…
 
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Istabraq said:
This is pretty much why I take the view I do about first season novices being allowed to compete in the handicaps.
Hollow Games has been talked all season about being an Albert Bartlett horse, capable of winning a G1 festival novice hurdle, but when the handicapper issues a mark like that you can see why heads might get turned to handicaps…
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Agree fully, I tell you something thou which a few might scoff at but If Minella Cocooner had been the jolly and a bit more hype like Hollow Games(that's not a dig ) He'd prob of got a higher rating than the 143 he's ended up with and others would be marked up or at the least stayed on the same ratings. Capper clearly didn't think it was a strong renewal vs previous 3 which time will only tell but and you see it time and time again when one seemingly unconsidered goes in.
 
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DenmanSacre said:
Irish handicapper marks:

Grand Jury 138
Hollow Games 138
Minella Crooner 139
Minella Cocooner 143


Ginto was given 146 for comparison purposes.
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I backed the Ginto / Hollow Games (Pipe) NRNB double last night.

I think NRNB you have to back Minalla Crooner and Hollow Games at double figures.... likely to be money back but either would go off single figures....

A bit of faffing so won't be for everyone but you'd be in a decent spot.
 
Kevloaf said:
I backed the Ginto / Hollow Games (Pipe) NRNB double last night.

I think NRNB you have to back Minalla Crooner and Hollow Games at double figures.... likely to be money back but either would go off single figures....

A bit of faffing so won't be for everyone but you'd be in a decent spot.
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I like these and was contemplating the bets.

May have to yield, and get them on!
 
ComplyOrDie said:
22nd February I believe, though stand to be corrected :encouragement:
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Enter by noon, February 22nd and pay ?95 stake
Confirm by noon on March 12th and pay ?280
Declare by 10.00 a.m. March 16th
Weights published on March 1st
 
FinalFurlong91 said:
The more I see hollow games run the more I just dont think hes a grade 1 standard horse

Kinda reminds me of stattler last season

Iv got nice prices on him but I'd be pretty surprised if he won at this stage
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I would agree and have cashed out. He just looks really one paced imo. The handicap mark is tempting but back at 2m4f, there's always going to be quicker horses passing him at the finish.
 
Adamantly Chosen declared on Thursday over 2 miles.

He was very green on hurdles debut, ran exceptional well considering greenness and form of that race is working out well. He was then beat in Cork by Ebasari conceding nearly a stone, both pulled clear of the field in the straight.

He is only 5 with little racing experience so was likely to improve throughout the season, Mullins pre season mentioned he will likely step up in trip as the season progresses.
 
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