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2022 Triumph Hurdle

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nortonscoin200 said:
Reckon you have a point GS.

As punters it's not what we want and, if you're right, it's a shame our multiple champion trainer believes he doesn't have the ammo to take on Ireland's finest in several Festival races.

But maybe he's just taking the pragmatic approach.
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At least we don’t need to back any of his horses antepost for March.

I just feel disappointed for those that do, when the news comes out that they don’t run.
 
Quevega said:
The reason is that their Irish counterparts are better.

And they rarely come out with shit excuses like bottoming horses.
FWIW I have no major problems with trainers running their owners horses where they all see fit. If I owned a horse in the uk and thought the Irish were better then I’d avoid them.
it’s the bullshit that comes out of their mouths I take issue with.
and the ammunition argument is also a bug bare.
The best Irish trainers would get more out of the horses trained in the uk on average and the opposite would be true if they sent some over here.
nichols got several good horses from Willie last year and that went well.
he could have proved a point, and sadly he did.
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I suspect you’re probably right about Irish trainers being able to get more out of UK horses than vice versa. Henderson and Skelton aside, it is as if the UK trainers have stood still over the last 5-10 years and the Irish trainers have kept improving. I couldn’t say why. It is most likely a number of factors and then it becomes a virtuous circle which is difficult to break. ie when the winners keep coming it is easier to attract the right owners. For example, UK owners like Cheveley Park Stud or going back a few years Graham Wylie could have selected to send their horses to UK trainers but didn’t.

I imagine the Irish trainers have better relationships with the top Irish point to point trainers and are able to move more quickly to secure the best horses. But that is surely only part of the puzzle. As to training ability and practices I can’t imagine the facilities in Ireland are any better than those held and enjoyed by Henderson, Nichols and Skelton. So what else is going on?
 
germanshepherd said:
They forced his hand by winning the King George. His best usually do run there that's the point. Cyrname hasn't run at Cheltenham. I know you have ?10 a point though. Probably more than Spectre with his 20 points at ?2 a point :topsy_turvy:
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Sadly you lose all credibility when you start trolling again German Shephard. This is the second time now. It's not necessary, and just childish. Do you see it anywhere else on the forum? No.

Back to the point. And I completely agree with you. Nicholls is simply pragmatic. If he thinks he can win at Cheltenham he'll go there. If he doesn't, or he doesn't wan to overface a young horse he'll go the Aintree, and that's fair enough in my book. I think he's unfairly criticised. He doesn't have access to all the best yound horses as he once did, and he has to make the best of what his current situation is.

Overall I believe his priority is to win the trainers championship each season, and he needs prizemoney to do that. Aintree offers excellent prizemoney without a significant Irish threat, and if he sees the opportunity to win there, rather than likely run down the field at Cheltenham he'll do so, and surely that's fair enough. Other than Monmiral, who was a juvenile that he regards as a potentially exciting future chaser, what didn't he run at Cheltenham that would have troubled the win and place horses?

It's also worth noting how he campaigns his horses form early on. Many are kept to flat tracks, others predominantly right-handed, but those that he thinks may go to Cheltenham often start at Chepstow rather than Wincanton for example. Or he'll get them to Newbury or even Cheltenham itself during the season.
 
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Porticello declared on Friday at Wetherby in the Listed Juvenile hurdle
 
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germanshepherd said:
Why everyone digging him out then? If he hasn't got the horses he wont run them there. Up yours!
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:culpability:

:dejection:

:eagerness: Nobody should get that annoyed on here to get personal, or mention other members where it isn't needed.

No-one forces you to log in, you do it by choice, so play nice or don't turn up.
 
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Really looking forward to seeing porticello’s British debut on Friday WTL. I mentioned him a couple of months ago in the general chat thread, and interestingly a recent article by made playle used the same comments almost word for word. Is she a member or a secret lurker.
anyway I hope he does the business later this week:grief::chuncky:
 
I think this can be an open race between trainers over the years, so I'm not too concerned about having to just back a Mullins/Gordon/Henderson Horse.

The three I've backed early are:

Benaud (backed 25/1 e/w)- who has the ill fated Sir Erec feel about him and could be as good if he takes to hurdles - I do like O'Brien and JP combo for the triumph.

Matterhorn (backed 50/1 e/w) - they think he could be very good, but will Nicholls run him!

Porticello - (backed 33/1) that race he won against Magistrato in France looks like it was a decent race and vibes about this horse are positive, can Moore get a bit of justice this year?

Can't wait to see them all run.
 
There could be a new, potentially interesting horse to consider in this market that was purchased at the HIT sale this week. Pied Piper, originally trained by Gosden, has been purchased by Andrew and Gemma Brown to go into training with Gordon. He finished rated 96 on the flat and signed off with a handicap win over 1m2f off 89. He’s by New Approach who has not really produced anything top class over jumps, but they’ve obviously seen something in him. It seems he’ll go jumping and then back on the flat in the summer.
 
There are a few that have been bought at the HIT this week by National Hunt owners. I'm always concerned that they're over the top from the flat season when they're bought from this sale. I don't have any stats to back this up, but I don't recall a winner of either the Triumph or the Boodles that came from it. I have a feeling the tend to be horses that pop up the following season over jumps, after sometimes getting a limited summer flat campaign.

There are bound to be exceptions though, so it anyone does know of any horses that have popped up at the Festival having been bought from it let me know, because things like this are always worth doing the investigation work.
 
Alan king has just bought us one from the HIT sales for this very purpose. Not a route we’ve gone before, but hopefully will be a bit of fun.
needs gelding first mind:worked_till_5am:
 
Maxfield said:
I think this can be an open race between trainers over the years, so I'm not too concerned about having to just back a Mullins/Gordon/Henderson Horse.

The three I've backed early are:

Benaud (backed 25/1 e/w)- who has the ill fated Sir Erec feel about him and could be as good if he takes to hurdles - I do like O'Brien and JP combo for the triumph.

Matterhorn (backed 50/1 e/w) - they think he could be very good, but will Nicholls run him!

Porticello - (backed 33/1) that race he won against Magistrato in France looks like it was a decent race and vibes about this horse are positive, can Moore get a bit of justice this year?

Can't wait to see them all run.
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Just had a look at the Porticello race in france, 5 of them from that race have won since including like you say Magistrato who looked impressive, so its does look like it was a strong race. Added him in at 25/1.
 
Guinness Village said:
Alan king has just bought us one from the HIT sales for this very purpose. Not a route we’ve gone before, but hopefully will be a bit of fun.
needs gelding first mind:worked_till_5am:
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Which one did you buy GV?
 
Many Clouds said:
Just had a look at the Porticello race in france, 5 of them from that race have won since including like you say Magistrato who looked impressive, so its does look like it was a strong race. Added him in at 25/1.
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Yes the well beaten third won a listed race and came second in a grade 2

Form looks very strong
 
Lot 787 spectre. Most went for well above our budget. 3yo colt with Harry Dunlop called thunder ahead. Fingers crossed for bit of fun
 
The very best of luck with him GV. I'll watch him with interest. Keep us up to speed with how he progresses.
 
"Porticello is a great, big horse and I can’t believe he was able to win at Auteuil in April as a three-year-old," said Moore. "He goes nicely, although he wouldn't be the flashiest work horse. Hopefully, he shows more on the racecourse than he does at home.
"He was pretty expensive and the form of his win in France obviously looks pretty good. I just hope he lives up to his reputation."
 
….plenty of Oddschecker blue for Porticello ahead of its run this afternoon. Still 25-1 with 365, as low as 16-1 with PP.

Sky offer 33-1 to win today & Triumph.
 
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Sounds like he could be Moore of a chaser to me.
 
Eggs said:
….plenty of Oddschecker blue for Porticello ahead of its run this afternoon. Still 25-1 with 365, as low as 16-1 with PP.

Sky offer 33-1 to win today & Triumph.
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Got that price up earlier, was hoping for 40/1 but noticed he's been clipped to 20/1 in the overall market there. Still happy I got 33/1 a few months back when I originally got him added to the market just hope he proves his worth today
 
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