General Chat

[opatcho]

Yeah, a little disappointed as Tuesday was always the day to go to

Two day DRF has it spot on

 

[Hurricane fly]

Agreed, Tuesday was always my favourite day, and I think the big money trebles and 4fold was always a good story like in punters vs bookies for the festival.

Champions Day just lost a champions race.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

Agreed, Tuesday was always my favourite day, and I think the big money trebles and 4fold was always a good story like in punters vs bookies for the festival.

Champions Day just lost a champions race.

I think it creates more balance having 3 x G1s a day but yes this does take something away from day one, and the title of champions day might need a re-think…

 

[Yosser]

Just been watching a Talking Points from either last week or the week before on Nick Luck. Mentioned that Hills are planning to close up to 200 shops, I think the number is dependent on whether the racing tax comes into force and if it does, there will be an industry wide cull of shops.

Feels like the last door is being closed behind us. All eyes on Rachel Reeves, but you just know the incompetent bint will go through with it.

 

[Muswell]

I see Gordon said king of kingsfield is going to have a break now til the spring and better ground what kind of English mark is he likely to get?


145 seems to be the answer

 

[Yosser]

Just been watching a Talking Points from either last week or the week before on Nick Luck. Mentioned that Hills are planning to close up to 200 shops, I think the number is dependent on whether the racing tax comes into force and if it does, there will be an industry wide cull of shops.

Feels like the last door is being closed behind us. All eyes on Rachel Reeves, but you just know the incompetent bint will go through with it.

Just to add to this. Fred Done has done an interview this morning saying he may close all of his shops if the tax is implemented. Paddy Power have announced 57 shops are going. Looks like this is definitely the last year

Link here

Loading…

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[fatherjohn]

its not surprising bookies are shutting is it. our were empty yesterday at 3pm for champions day ascot and pretty much anyone gambling in last 15 years has uses a smartphone so no need to go to a shop. they are dying out anyway as the experience hasn't got any better in most places and offers on apps are usually better/easier to access. same with bookies at the course.

 

[Magpie]

Bookies closing in high street felt like it was going to happen at some point anyway. Can’t say it’s a particularly nice experience being in there, and only seems small stake gamblers and slot machine addicts in there.

 

[Yosser]

It was always going to happen at some point, i agree with that. This seems like the excuse they need to shut them all and save face where they can just blame the government for all the job losses.

The elephant in the room............ us. All restricted and banned from placing decent online bets and relying on the shops. Beat the SP online a couple of times. Instant restrictions (usually about 40p(ish) in my experience for a 12/1 shot) regardless on how much you have lost that week, month, year. As 100% of us are here with the sole purpose of beating the SP for 28 races in 4 days, let the wild west commence. Imagine what they are going to be like knowing they have full control of your betting activities. Sharing info with each other etc.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

its not surprising bookies are shutting is it. our were empty yesterday at 3pm for champions day ascot and pretty much anyone gambling in last 15 years has uses a smartphone so no need to go to a shop. they are dying out anyway as the experience hasn't got any better in most places and offers on apps are usually better/easier to access. same with bookies at the course.

You Sir can consider yourself extremely fortunate to still have unrestricted accounts, there are many in here who don't and have to get creative with placing bets and shops play a valuable role in that....

 

[Cheltmas]

Just to add to this. Fred Done has done an interview this morning saying he may close all of his shops if the tax is implemented. Paddy Power have announced 57 shops are going. Looks like this is definitely the last year

Link here

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c5ydpmy7mj1o[/URL

http://

Just to add to this. Fred Done has done an interview this morning saying he may close all of his shops if the tax is implemented. Paddy Power have announced 57 shops are going. Looks like this is definitely the last year

Link here

Loading…

www.bbc.co.uk

Yeah I’m getting very worried about the shops closing.
Its another nail in the coffin for those of us who prefer using cash.
Feel sorry for the staff at risk of losing their jobs.
On a personal note, I regularly use the terminal in my local Fred’s to chip away at Cheltenham with a few quid when I have to nip into town.
I’m concerned about my slips now if the shops all suddenly shut.

 

[fatherjohn]

You Sir can consider yourself extremely fortunate to still have unrestricted accounts, there are many in here who don't and have to get creative with placing bets and shops play a valuable role in that....

I think you've missed my point. its not about my behaviour but more a comment that bookies are struggling before any tax rise because generally people have better options. not everyone but most do. there is no way 15 years ago my bookies in town would be empty for a big meet. times have moved on and they haven't other than imo trying to cream off fobt and doing nothing to attract a new generation.

 

[Eggs]

its not surprising bookies are shutting is it. our were empty yesterday at 3pm for champions day ascot and pretty much anyone gambling in last 15 years has uses a smartphone so no need to go to a shop. they are dying out anyway as the experience hasn't got any better in most places and offers on apps are usually better/easier to access. same with bookies at the course.

…..gone are the days where they’d lock the ‘Pricewise’ table prices for 15mins after opening. That always attracted a few punters. Beyond that, a shop opposite a boozer always had a steady flow but folk can stay in the bar and bet these days.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

I think you've missed my point. its not about my behaviour but more a comment that bookies are struggling before any tax rise because generally people have better options. not everyone but most do. there is no way 15 years ago my bookies in town would be empty for a big meet. times have moved on and they haven't other than imo trying to cream off fobt and doing nothing to attract a new generation.

OK understood
Unless I dreamt it I think I saw something yesterday that 53% of turnover that gets paid to the levy still comes via shops, so if shops continue to disappear there will be even less money that goes into racing, also you'll probably find punters who rely on shops will be split into two catagories, one group will just stop punting and find something else to do, the second group will head to black market and create further problems that consecutive governments continue to ignore.
It's a mess and it has the capability of crippling the racing industry...

 

[Yosser]

http://

Yeah I’m getting very worried about the shops closing.
Its another nail in the coffin for those of us who prefer using cash.
Feel sorry for the staff at risk of losing their jobs.
On a personal note, I regularly use the terminal in my local Fred’s to chip away at Cheltenham with a few quid when I have to nip into town.
I’m concerned about my slips now if the shops all suddenly shut.

I don't think it would be instant. They would put a date on it in the future. Probably after the Grand National. That is the day you can guarantee shops are busy all over the country. If they did, i wouldn't worry. The bets are placed and they have a legal obligation to pay out, there will be some way of collecting.

 

[Yosser]

OK understood
Unless I dreamt it I think I saw something yesterday that 53% of turnover that gets paid to the levy still comes via shops, so if shops continue to disappear there will be even less money that goes into racing, also you'll probably find punters who rely on shops will be split into two catagories, one group will just stop punting and find something else to do, the second group will head to black market and create further problems that consecutive governments continue to ignore.
It's a mess and it has the capability of crippling the racing industry...

I think that is what is coming. I said last year after Cheltenham i would have a good think about going around again this time because i could smell the tactics of bookies getting more devious. It's almost like they don't want you having a bet. If you aren't interested in the games machines or ridiculous bet builder type bets that hardly anybody can win on, they don't care for your custom.

Whatever happens, i intend on taking them to the cleaners this festival and waving at them with my two fingers as i walk out of the shop

 

[Wayward Lad]

OK understood
Unless I dreamt it I think I saw something yesterday that 53% of turnover that gets paid to the levy still comes via shops, so if shops continue to disappear there will be even less money that goes into racing, also you'll probably find punters who rely on shops will be split into two catagories, one group will just stop punting and find something else to do, the second group will head to black market and create further problems that consecutive governments continue to ignore.
It's a mess and it has the capability of crippling the racing industry...

It’s a mess that has been coming for a fair while……12000 betting shops 25 years ago, 9000 not that long ago and now around 6000

FOBT’s slowed the trend of betting shop decline, but now that restrictions have been placed on FOBT stakes which basically makes them fruit machines, then the trend has started again following the previous decline curve

The basic issue for betting shops is that the bookmakers offering can be made through the internet at a much reduced cost (no rates, no rent, massively reduced wage cost etc). In addition the decline of the Horse racing product in shops is that it is so expensive to offer as a product (media rights and levy) especially when compared to Football (which now will probably generate more turnover and most certainly more profit than horse racing and has no media rights or levy cost)….fruit machines have only a licence cost and rent, numbers and other sports betting don’t have hardly any associated costs…….these costs are all before any government taxation.

Horse racing used to be the product that was seen as the ‘hook’ to get people into a betting shop…..it’s now Football and the customer profile is different. But with the development of websites and the smartphone why would a young male who wants a bet on Football go into a betting shop nowadays when they can transact everything through their smartphone, whether at the match, or around their mates place watching TV?

What isn’t being discussed around the potential spike in betting shops closures enough IMO is the immediate impact on monies being paid to racecourses. Media rights payments maybe directly linked to the number of betting shops and therefore there could be immediate reductions in payments. The closing of shops speed due to estate reviews, either before or after 26th Nov, will inevitably impact media rights and levy payments which will reduce and cause lots of consternation amongst racings key stakeholders. But will they be joined up enough to take the difficult decisions rather than just let racecourses reduce prize money as they do now? how many racecourses offer poor product, fodder and would not be able to survive without subsidisation from betting derived monies? How many big race external company sponsors have been lost over the years with betting companies picking up the sponsorship as other external company sponsors could not be found?

The horse racing products monetisation cannot continue to support the number of racecourses in this country……it needs to be reduced substantially and each location needs to be geographically positioned based upon public density.

If there is less money being available to support horse racing and less horses being available (another decline trend) then spread the existing numbers of both over less races and less racecourses and maybe the product can improve in terms of entrants in each race, prize money levels, competitiveness etc…….everything else is window dressing IMO

The new BHA boss, operating one day a week, has a monumental job to do!

 

[Wayward Lad]

Interesting bit of info from ‘Cheltenham Man’ being interviewed in the RP, about his view on how self service betting terminals in betting shops operate and how he works around them;

- £35 stake level acceptance (not liability level as I suspected)
- terminal resets every 20 mins or so, with further bets being accepted
- the terminal may have cameras within them as the staff may have pictures attached to some betting records for large bettors/risk customers
- whatever you do around getting stakes on the terminal, then when collecting returns/winnings etc at the counter will potentially trigger flags on the EPoS system that dictates for staff to have a conversation around future restrictions etc

 

[Guinness Village]

Interesting bit of info from ‘Cheltenham Man’ being interviewed in the RP, about his view on how self service betting terminals in betting shops operate and how he works around them;

- £35 stake level acceptance (not liability level as I suspected)
- terminal resets every 20 mins or so, with further bets being accepted
- the terminal may have cameras within them as the staff may have pictures attached to some betting records for large bettors/risk customers
- whatever you do around getting stakes on the terminal, then when collecting returns/winnings etc at the counter will potentially trigger flags on the EPoS system that dictates for staff to have a conversation around future restrictions etc

I’ve only had welfare checks on pick ups.

 

[Exar Essay]

we

Interesting bit of info from ‘Cheltenham Man’ being interviewed in the RP, about his view on how self service betting terminals in betting shops operate and how he works around them;

- £35 stake level acceptance (not liability level as I suspected)
- terminal resets every 20 mins or so, with further bets being accepted
- the terminal may have cameras within them as the staff may have pictures attached to some betting records for large bettors/risk customers
- whatever you do around getting stakes on the terminal, then when collecting returns/winnings etc at the counter will potentially trigger flags on the EPoS system that dictates for staff to have a conversation around future restrictions etc

He used to post on here for a short while. Gave some very good information including, if I recall correctly, the weights for the festival a day early!