General Chat

[Frankely My Dear]

Standard behaviour.
Virgin was one of my more humurous restrictions/closures, opened an acc on a Saturday morning, deposited a grand, had four 50ew bets, no winners, two placed to give me a tiny profit, by 6pm that same evening I'd received three e-mails telling me:
1. BOG has been removed from my acc
2. I'm no longer eligible for promotions
3. Restrictions had been placed on my acc.

I don't know how much experience you've had with acc restrictions but there's no point asking the question, they'll say traders decision and they're not obliged to provide any explanation.

In a normal world we'd have a regulator to manage such behaviour and protect punters but the the shower of shit we have in the UK are so far up bookmakers arses the entire industry works for them.
Shops or the dark side is the future I'm afraid...

Sky were the first to screw me because I placed all of their free bets on the Gold Cup and they didn't like that strategy. William Hill did it for me placing a few losing bets, don't think I even had any free bets with them. Never challenged either. Have done with Virgin just to see what they say, waste their time. Have a few unrestricted accounts left but I doubt that will last after March 25 so I'll frequent the shops after that

 

[Ice]

Standard behaviour.
Virgin was one of my more humurous restrictions/closures, opened an acc on a Saturday morning, deposited a grand, had four 50ew bets, no winners, two placed to give me a tiny profit, by 6pm that same evening I'd received three e-mails telling me:
1. BOG has been removed from my acc
2. I'm no longer eligible for promotions
3. Restrictions had been placed on my acc.

I don't know how much experience you've had with acc restrictions but there's no point asking the question, they'll say traders decision and they're not obliged to provide any explanation.

In a normal world we'd have a regulator to manage such behaviour and protect punters but the the shower of shit we have in the UK are so far up bookmakers arses the entire industry works for them.
Shops or the dark side is the future I'm afraid...

It does need something doing but like you say it's not going to happen, the bookmarking industry really does need a regulator to stop this sort of shit happening, it's a disgrace and they shouldn't be allowed to even call themselves bookmakers !

 

[ComplyOrDie]

Unfortunately to continuously overcome the issues of account restrictions and closures the only path that works is using willing family members names to open up new accounts.

Not ideal, admittedly, but it can work.

Bet365
Ladbrokes/Coral
Betfair

They are the only remaining bookmakers I have without restrictions, and also offers/bonuses are mostly available too.

I can still use some offers with William Hill and VirginBet, but these seem somewhat tailored to an area I don't want to part cash with.

Annoyingly, a very old self exclusion (from when I was 19/20, and not even a real reason to self exclude to be honest) on a SkyBet account led to me nearly losing my Betfair account, because it had flagged up as SkyBet are one of their sister companies. Luckily I managed to regain control though had to put a slight restriction on deposit limits, however I was told this could be adjusted after 1 year, which has now passed.

Shops & cash are the way forward, but obviously offer no cash out (not a problem if you're not used to it anyway), and also means holding on to betting slips long term, which can be a pain in the arse if you're not organised :highly_amused:

 

[Yosser]

Unfortunately to continuously overcome the issues of account restrictions and closures the only path that works is using willing family members names to open up new accounts.

Not ideal, admittedly, but it can work.

Bet365
Ladbrokes/Coral
Betfair

They are the only remaining bookmakers I have without restrictions, and also offers/bonuses are mostly available too.

I can still use some offers with William Hill and VirginBet, but these seem somewhat tailored to an area I don't want to part cash with.

Annoyingly, a very old self exclusion (from when I was 19/20, and not even a real reason to self exclude to be honest) on a SkyBet account led to me nearly losing my Betfair account, because it had flagged up as SkyBet are one of their sister companies. Luckily I managed to regain control though had to put a slight restriction on deposit limits, however I was told this could be adjusted after 1 year, which has now passed.

Shops & cash are the way forward, but obviously offer no cash out (not a problem if you're not used to it anyway), and also means holding on to betting slips long term, which can be a pain in the arse if you're not organised :highly_amused:

I've got a folder and on the inside is plastic wallets. My betting shop dockets all live in their correct races.

I'm just waiting for the day where one of my accounts gets shut before cheltenham, completely ruining the ante post book. That's why this season is the last. Either that or wait until closer to the time next year and rather than build books, do my bollocks on one big bet per race. I will never understand why the bookies think racing is irrelevant. But they are well on the way of making it obsolete. Ad restrictions coming into force in Ireland, bookies having a free hand to just shut and restrict accounts willy nilly. Nobody will ever be interested in regulating it. Betting on racing and racing in general will just be allowed to whittle away to nothing unless somebody steps in but that seems unlikely right now

 

[robith]

Hi all, been away on holiday and tbh interest in the sport atm is pretty low, but catching up and quite surprised at some of the reactions on here to the changes. The sport is becoming borderline uncompetitive which won't survive as a betting product, they make changes to do what lots of us complain about, and people are seemingly legit angry cos it will be harder antepost? Mad scenes.

I think the changes will make the BANC and the Arkle way more competitive which is only good for the festival as a spectacle

 

[HesTheOne]

I've got a folder and on the inside is plastic wallets. My betting shop dockets all live in their correct races.

I'm just waiting for the day where one of my accounts gets shut before cheltenham, completely ruining the ante post book. That's why this season is the last. Either that or wait until closer to the time next year and rather than build books, do my bollocks on one big bet per race. I will never understand why the bookies think racing is irrelevant. But they are well on the way of making it obsolete. Ad restrictions coming into force in Ireland, bookies having a free hand to just shut and restrict accounts willy nilly. Nobody will ever be interested in regulating it. Betting on racing and racing in general will just be allowed to whittle away to nothing unless somebody steps in but that seems unlikely right now

Yea agreed. Not sure if many listen to the AK podcast (bit of a pessimistic cunt at times) but he was saying yesterday it costs about 6 or 7c to take a bet in Ireland with the overheads involved in racing.

Changing legislation and public opinion, dwindling population of good horses and fragmented power struggles .. racing unfortunately is doomed to die

I think the only thing that can save it now is complete consolidation/centralisation of power. Way too many factions from the BHA, JockeyClub, Bookies, Race Courses, Media they all worry about their own bottom line and pull in different directions for it to ever turn the tide.

Only thing that could save it would be a sovereign wealth fund to take over the whole fkn thing and run it

 

[robith]

Been away so don't know if anyone has already flagged it but the legendary GaultStats is winding it up after the coming festival. Always donate to the fund, gotten many a winner from his trends over the years

 

[Frankely My Dear]

Unfortunately to continuously overcome the issues of account restrictions and closures the only path that works is using willing family members names to open up new accounts.

Not ideal, admittedly, but it can work.

Bet365
Ladbrokes/Coral
Betfair

They are the only remaining bookmakers I have without restrictions, and also offers/bonuses are mostly available too.

I can still use some offers with William Hill and VirginBet, but these seem somewhat tailored to an area I don't want to part cash with.

Annoyingly, a very old self exclusion (from when I was 19/20, and not even a real reason to self exclude to be honest) on a SkyBet account led to me nearly losing my Betfair account, because it had flagged up as SkyBet are one of their sister companies. Luckily I managed to regain control though had to put a slight restriction on deposit limits, however I was told this could be adjusted after 1 year, which has now passed.

Shops & cash are the way forward, but obviously offer no cash out (not a problem if you're not used to it anyway), and also means holding on to betting slips long term, which can be a pain in the arse if you're not organised :highly_amused:

I'm no longer arsed about cash out and my approach this year works then shops will work for me going forward. Hopefully my mate's woeful football bets on my account will keep it going

 

[Saxon Warrior]

Yea agreed. Not sure if many listen to the AK podcast (bit of a pessimistic cunt at times) but he was saying yesterday it costs about 6 or 7c to take a bet in Ireland with the overheads involved in racing.

Changing legislation and public opinion, dwindling population of good horses and fragmented power struggles .. racing unfortunately is doomed to die

I think the only thing that can save it now is complete consolidation/centralisation of power. Way too many factions from the BHA, JockeyClub, Bookies, Race Courses, Media they all worry about their own bottom line and pull in different directions for it to ever turn the tide.

Only thing that could save it would be a sovereign wealth fund to take over the whole fkn thing and run it

Definitely in a Doom Spiral, as betting/racing are reliant on each other and online bookmakers dont want "racing only" punters on their mostly cartoon casino sites

I take every year as it comes.

Expecting bookmakers in the end to all lose their licence to bet fixed odds on horse racing in GB and IRE and everything to go to Pari-Mutuel/Tote style betting.

Seems probably the only long term way to sustain the sport, and to lever it away from the cartoon casino sites, who restrict access to so many horse racing punters already.

.

 

[Yosser]

I've got a folder and on the inside is plastic wallets. My betting shop dockets all live in their correct races.

I'm just waiting for the day where one of my accounts gets shut before cheltenham, completely ruining the ante post book. That's why this season is the last. Either that or wait until closer to the time next year and rather than build books, do my bollocks on one big bet per race. I will never understand why the bookies think racing is irrelevant. But they are well on the way of making it obsolete. Ad restrictions coming into force in Ireland, bookies having a free hand to just shut and restrict accounts willy nilly. Nobody will ever be interested in regulating it. Betting on racing and racing in general will just be allowed to whittle away to nothing unless somebody steps in but that seems unlikely right now

Guess what has just happened to me. Wouldn't disclose financial details so bye bye 1 account. Down to my last one now. Cheltenham ante post partly decimated, breeders cup ante post - gone, King George bets - gone. Put a curse on myself there didnt I. Fortunately I keep track of what I have put on where so now I have the money back I am going to have to do some more shop bets. Its actually allows me to move some of the cheltenham money I wasn't that concerned about anymore onto others although I have lost quite a few nice prices but will claw that back. Breeders cup ante post I can claw back i think but the king George prices are long gone. Cheers government

 

[Frankely My Dear]

That sucks ass Yosser I'm sorry to hear that. This financial disclosure BS is going to catch a lot of people out. Who was the account with?

 

[Yosser]

That sucks ass Yosser I'm sorry to hear that. This financial disclosure BS is going to catch a lot of people out. Who was the account with?

Shitty VBet with their dial up style interface and draconian settlement times. I knew there was a risk with a bookie like that but little choice left. I knew something was stirring. Don't hear a peep when a bet goes down but after back to back 13/2 and 15/2 winners you start getting emails and messages pretending they are interested what you do for a living etc. I don't suppose it's any use to tell them that I am 39 and have worked my fingers to the bone in construction and engineering pretty much since the day I left school in 2001. I am now running a house and car by myself and in no way would jeopardise any of those things. Besides all that. Its none of their business. I could have sent them it but won't on a point of principle. Morrisons deliver my shopping on a Saturday morning but they don't ring me and ask if I can afford it first. Lots of book analysis when I get home later and see where I can make some chops and changes. I can rescue a couple of breeders bets but the rest will be in the night.

 

[isitmarchyet]

Not sure which thread to pop this in, but Classical Creek entered in the bumper at Punchestown on Wednesday.

 

[Wayward Lad]

Regarding bookmakers closing accounts because of saying no to financial disclosure - are we saying that ante post bets tendered and accepted many months back are stakes refunded IF not disclosing personal financial info later on with other bets that trigger the request ?

If this is the case then this seems contractually wrong as bets were laid in good faith at the time of placement. If accounts are closed in this manner then what’s stopping a bookmaker to look at their liabilities ante post from time to time and request financial info from customers who have good ante post positions and hope they capitulate by not providing financial info ? Surely the worst position is no more bets accepted with ante post bets to run their time ?

Although closing accounts for customers who do not disclose their financial info is morally wrong, then treating ante post bets as void is potential robbery, as their financial value could be more than the initial stake ie better prices than the current market.

Them bookmakers need challenging methinks !

 

[Imperial Commander]

Regarding bookmakers closing accounts because of saying no to financial disclosure - are we saying that ante post bets tendered and accepted many months back are stakes refunded IF not disclosing personal financial info later on with other bets that trigger the request ?

If this is the case then this seems contractually wrong as bets were laid in good faith at the time of placement. If accounts are closed in this manner then what’s stopping a bookmaker to look at their liabilities ante post from time to time and request financial info from customers who have good ante post positions and hope they capitulate by not providing financial info ? Surely the worst position is no more bets accepted with ante post bets to run their time ?

Although closing accounts for customers who do not disclose their financial info is morally wrong, then treating ante post bets as void is potential robbery, as their financial value could be more than the initial stake ie better prices than the current market.

Them bookmakers need challenging methinks !

Completely agree.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

Regarding bookmakers closing accounts because of saying no to financial disclosure - are we saying that ante post bets tendered and accepted many months back are stakes refunded IF not disclosing personal financial info later on with other bets that trigger the request ?

If this is the case then this seems contractually wrong as bets were laid in good faith at the time of placement. If accounts are closed in this manner then what’s stopping a bookmaker to look at their liabilities ante post from time to time and request financial info from customers who have good ante post positions and hope they capitulate by not providing financial info ? Surely the worst position is no more bets accepted with ante post bets to run their time ?

Although closing accounts for customers who do not disclose their financial info is morally wrong, then treating ante post bets as void is potential robbery, as their financial value could be more than the initial stake ie better prices than the current market.

Them bookmakers need challenging methinks !

No, I’ve had this with several bookies.
Your acc lays dormant and when bets settle they have to pay you.
One bookie (Betway) refused this some years ago and I threatened legal action, they relented, basically you strike a bet it’s a contract, they can’t withhold funds unless you’re an arms dealer or similar….

 

[Frankely My Dear]

Shitty VBet with their dial up style interface and draconian settlement times. I knew there was a risk with a bookie like that but little choice left. I knew something was stirring. Don't hear a peep when a bet goes down but after back to back 13/2 and 15/2 winners you start getting emails and messages pretending they are interested what you do for a living etc. I don't suppose it's any use to tell them that I am 39 and have worked my fingers to the bone in construction and engineering pretty much since the day I left school in 2001. I am now running a house and car by myself and in no way would jeopardise any of those things. Besides all that. Its none of their business. I could have sent them it but won't on a point of principle. Morrisons deliver my shopping on a Saturday morning but they don't ring me and ask if I can

​​afford it first. Lots of book analysis when I get home later and see where I can make some chops and changes. I can rescue a couple of breeders bets but the rest will be in the night.

That's what they don't (want to) understand, that people can manage their finances and gamble without risking their home or family. I appreciate there are numpties (and vulnerable people) out there but the risk with those is the marketing and temptation put out there with the flashing lights and promises of riches. Through mind-numbing spinning columns and bingo mainly.
The truth in my opinion is they don't want successful punters on their books. Sounds like Ista might have a point about threatening legal action over your bets being contracts and therefore can't subsequently be voided, if I've understood his post correctly.

Well done on your wins btw

 

[somer1]

I see that Dan Skelton and Ben Pauling have stable tours on ATR. Are we going to have a thread just for tours?

 

[Yosser]

That's what they don't (want to) understand, that people can manage their finances and gamble without risking their home or family. I appreciate there are numpties (and vulnerable people) out there but the risk with those is the marketing and temptation put out there with the flashing lights and promises of riches. Through mind-numbing spinning columns and bingo mainly.
The truth in my opinion is they don't want successful punters on their books. Sounds like Ista might have a point about threatening legal action over your bets being contracts and therefore can't subsequently be voided, if I've understood his post correctly.

Well done on your wins btw

I didn't even enquire about that to be honest. It left a sour taste. I said that i wasn't disclosing personal info and asked where that would leave me? I got a convoluted response saying they needed it so i asked if they could void the bets and close the account to which they agreed. Every week, 2 lots of £25 leaves my bank, one goes into a savings account and one goes into a bonus savings one for any betting, i tried explaining this but they wanted to see. I am more annoyed about the King George bets than the Cheltenham ones although Con Hill, Jonbon and Teahupoo have shortened considerably but because i am betting across 2 online bookies and in 2 shops, most of my bets have been spread around so now will go and re-fill those holes in shop. On the flip side though, Most of my El Fabiolo money was on there and after the news last night will leave for now, Ballyburn Arkle money which i am going cold on for some reason and Impaire Et Passe 25/1 BANC which i am also going cold on (I have lost all stakes on that). The annoying thing is that i paid for most of them with winnings so just threw loads of random fillers in there. They probably didn't like me using their money instead of my own. Ones i need to get re-backed this weekend are Jeroboam Machin - Gallaghers, Half stake on Il Etait Temps - Ryanair, Con Hill, Jonbon, Teahupoo and need to do some very small top ups on Jalon D'Oudaries - Gallaghers, Gerri - Gold Cup, Kainsbourg - Supreme, Caldwell Potter - BANC and need to do a complete bet on Kel Histoire - Supreme and ended up going in on Grangeclare West for both Ryanair and GC which i will get back on. I need to go out to hills anyway on Saturday to get Quantum Boy, Classical Creek and Leaky Cauldron in for the bumper. By Saturday afternoon i should be back in position and have a few hundred quid to spare.

 

[Yosser]

I see that Dan Skelton and Ben Pauling have stable tours on ATR. Are we going to have a thread just for tours?

Good idea.