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Stupid Questions
- Thread starter Brital
- Start date
I might be an ass but definitely not a Jennyig: (couldnt find a donkey)
I don't recall, calling you a Jenny either :cower:
Apologies if I did Jenny.
PresentingPercy
Fat Jockey Patron (est. March 2021)
Question I have been asking myself of late but cannot find an answer from doing some online research. What factors would play into a horse being better/bad at going left/right handed?
I get it if the horse jumps left or right at hurdles/fences, you lose ground there. But let's take Cyrname as an example of a horse that jumps as straight as a gun barrel yet the thinking was he could only run right handed (since found untrue). Any thoughts? Could it be a mental issue with some horses also?
I get it if the horse jumps left or right at hurdles/fences, you lose ground there. But let's take Cyrname as an example of a horse that jumps as straight as a gun barrel yet the thinking was he could only run right handed (since found untrue). Any thoughts? Could it be a mental issue with some horses also?
archie
Fat Jockey Patron
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Copied from EnvoyAllen's thread on preferences:
By and large, most horses are happy leading with either foreleg and switch without too much difficulty depending on whether they're going left-handed or right-handed (right leg lead on a left-handed course). Some, however, don't find it as easy. The longer the race, the bigger the issue, and with the added complication of jumping, this is almost exclusively a NH problem.
What it is all about is being in a rhythm to jump as efficiently as possible. Apart from the course direction, you have to consider its configuration. Undulations have an effect, as does the placement of fences/hurdles and whether there are long straights. Kemboy is a good example. Having won G1s at Aintree and Leopardstown, he obviously can go left-handed. Those two tracks feature long straights and his jumping there is generally very good. Cheltenham is on the turn for much of the circuit and, while he doesn't hate it, he doesn't seem to be able to get in the same rhythm. At G1 level that makes a difference. He also seems to enjoy it more when, other than given a good sight of the fence, left alone to do his own thing.
Other examples have been put forward and Desert Orchid is probably the most famous. He would emphatically not have won his Gold Cup if poor old Ten Plus had stood up. Another from my personal experience would be Lord Noelie. Although I didn't buy in until 3 years after his RSA win, it was made quite clear that he would not be running on right-handed tracks or on soft (or worse) going.
By and large, most horses are happy leading with either foreleg and switch without too much difficulty depending on whether they're going left-handed or right-handed (right leg lead on a left-handed course). Some, however, don't find it as easy. The longer the race, the bigger the issue, and with the added complication of jumping, this is almost exclusively a NH problem.
What it is all about is being in a rhythm to jump as efficiently as possible. Apart from the course direction, you have to consider its configuration. Undulations have an effect, as does the placement of fences/hurdles and whether there are long straights. Kemboy is a good example. Having won G1s at Aintree and Leopardstown, he obviously can go left-handed. Those two tracks feature long straights and his jumping there is generally very good. Cheltenham is on the turn for much of the circuit and, while he doesn't hate it, he doesn't seem to be able to get in the same rhythm. At G1 level that makes a difference. He also seems to enjoy it more when, other than given a good sight of the fence, left alone to do his own thing.
Other examples have been put forward and Desert Orchid is probably the most famous. He would emphatically not have won his Gold Cup if poor old Ten Plus had stood up. Another from my personal experience would be Lord Noelie. Although I didn't buy in until 3 years after his RSA win, it was made quite clear that he would not be running on right-handed tracks or on soft (or worse) going.
astontom
Fat Jockey Patron (est. Jan 2021)
Hi all, apologies if this is the wrong thread. I'm a novice and looking to learn more about the national hunt game. This site has been invaluable in my education. Can anyone recommend some books for beginners, I'm particularly interested in understanding handicaps more and also what is good to look for when watching a race. Thank you.
astontom
There are endless options AT, I know Weatherbys used to do a great Cheltenham trends guide but the author went off and did his own thing so no idea what it’s like now but I remember them firing all sorts of mail my way about everything horse racing related, link below.
Best of luck
https://bettrendsshop.co.uk/betting/
There are endless options AT, I know Weatherbys used to do a great Cheltenham trends guide but the author went off and did his own thing so no idea what it’s like now but I remember them firing all sorts of mail my way about everything horse racing related, link below.
Best of luck
https://bettrendsshop.co.uk/betting/
My own site has some content that is aimed at yourself, if anything else related I'm missing there is of interest, feel free to reply on here.
Guide to racing...
https://scooby91horseracingtips.com/...racing-series/
Think that covers all the rest .
https://scooby91horseracingtips.com/2021/01/05/guide-to-racing-series/
But What is it about HANDICAPS that interst you, if I may ask, as it may be something that I'm missing, i can add, and possibly interest others beginners also
https://scooby91horseracingtips.com/2021/01/05/guide-to-racing-series/
But What is it about HANDICAPS that interst you, if I may ask, as it may be something that I'm missing, i can add, and possibly interest others beginners also
Kotkijet
Juvenile expert - LUCKY 9 VEGAN MEGA BOX advocate
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This is fantastic work and well worth the read for anybody regardless of experience.
Scooby91 said:
I agree that flat ratings in and off themselves are insufficient when it comes to looking at juvenile hurdlers. Nevertheless, in the broadest scope, class does tend to translate and there is also a correlation when it comes to their ability to jump safely.
Forty pounds between codes is a solid basis for older horses. There are currently 440 in Britain with both flat and hurdle ratings, with the mean being 63.57 and 103.62, and median being 64 and 103. Curiously, the difference for juvenile hurdlers is an average of 45 pounds which is frankly ludicrous as it implies that despite being inexperienced, they are assumed to have improved to be better hurdlers than flat horses. If it is to account for the age allowance then it completely defeats the purpose of same.
I tend to use around thirty-five pounds as a rough guide and it is the figure I use to ascertain whether a horse has improved for the switch between codes. Since 2008/09, there have been 2571 juveniles who had official UK/IRE flat ratings and raced three times or more during their first jumps campaign. The average flat ratings are 64.14 mean, 64 median, but the average peak RPRs are 34.7 and 35 pounds higher respectively.
This is fantastic work and well worth the read for anybody regardless of experience.
I agree that flat ratings in and off themselves are insufficient when it comes to looking at juvenile hurdlers. Nevertheless, in the broadest scope, class does tend to translate and there is also a correlation when it comes to their ability to jump safely.
Forty pounds between codes is a solid basis for older horses. There are currently 440 in Britain with both flat and hurdle ratings, with the mean being 63.57 and 103.62, and median being 64 and 103. Curiously, the difference for juvenile hurdlers is an average of 45 pounds which is frankly ludicrous as it implies that despite being inexperienced, they are assumed to have improved to be better hurdlers than flat horses. If it is to account for the age allowance then it completely defeats the purpose of same.
I tend to use around thirty-five pounds as a rough guide and it is the figure I use to ascertain whether a horse has improved for the switch between codes. Since 2008/09, there have been 2571 juveniles who had official UK/IRE flat ratings and raced three times or more during their first jumps campaign. The average flat ratings are 64.14 mean, 64 median, but the average peak RPRs are 34.7 and 35 pounds higher respectively.
I will look into that into detail in the morning, many thanks for the reply, and very interesting
I feel like you two might become best friends.
Like me and jono
Except Jono ignores me texts and calls nowadays....
Turns out he thinks having a kid is more important than backing winners ante post.
So fuck him.
Position as my best friend is available...... but form an orderly queue so it's managable.
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Pfft, over rated waffle I'd say.
Who wants to hear about veganism when you can have 20 chicken nuggets and a wank.
......
...........I've heard...
The great irony is that I am a borderline asocial introvert whose idea of a perfect dinner guest is Ryan Moore
Would be a weird mix, as that people may not know that I have severe anxiety, and a condition called panic disorder, which may somewhat reveal why I am not the best at social interactions, and sometimes edit very simple things i have posted as I worry not to offend anyone accidentally.
people close to me find it fairly strange in the fact that I'm not in the slightest bit nervous watching a bet regardless of size or in the crowd at a race meeting. However i wouldnt be able to go a crowded restaurant for example..
It is weird to think you don't try to offend to be fair mate.... because some of your posts are right on the cusp :welcoming:
Or they used to be..... you are more reserved now haha