General Chat

[Black Dog]

Now that we know Ballyburn will have no intention in running in the Turner's, is it now a given he will be running in the Arkle?
Currently 5/2 to win but considering sky bet are paying out less than evens for him to win any race, is 5/2 now a steal? I think we are all in agreement that Ballyburn wins any race it enters so are the current 5/2 odds decent?

I don't agree he'll win the Champion Hurdle, and if he goes that route the 5/2 will look awful.

 

[YoungHustler]

Disappointed the Turners has gone as I liked the race. Had IEP at decent prices and in loads of multiples but swings and roundabouts as at least Brighterdaysahead now very likely to head for the Mares. I think IEP will now go BANC and along with Caldwell Potter and Dancing City, would be my 3 against anything else for now.

 

[TigerRolllllll]

Why does everyone think Bally goes Arkle?

Assuming he goes chasing (might not), then the target is surely 2026 Gold Cup, which as Willy has said he is bred for & owner wants

Seems an odd way to get there teaching a horse all the wrong things as a novice ….its a diff style of jumping altogether for 2m & 3m plus

it is Willie ….but having already won Gallagher, seems more logical to campaign over 2.5m over fences and gradually build to 3m

Markets do say Arkle, but I know some tipsters have also gone with my logic above

 

[Odin]

Why does everyone think Bally goes Arkle?

Assuming he goes chasing (might not), then the target is surely 2026 Gold Cup, which as Willy has said he is bred for & owner wants

Seems an odd way to get there teaching a horse all the wrong things as a novice ….its a diff style of jumping altogether for 2m & 3m plus

it is Willie ….but having already won Gallagher, seems more logical to campaign over 2.5m over fences and gradually build to 3m

Markets do say Arkle, but I know some tipsters have also gone with my logic above

For me, it's simply about how well he does or doesn't switch off. Although it seemed like he'd switched off pretty well last year, he just struck me as a perfect Turners horse like Galopin was in his year. I haven't really had time to reassess since, but if it's a choice between Impaire Et Passe and Ballyburn going Arkle (working under the heavily questionable assumption that they would be PT's two rides), I'd strongly favour Ballyburn as the 2 miler and IEP as the 3 miler on all known form. Particularly as Dancing City would give Mullins two extremely strong candidates in the RSA (a minor point in the grand scheme of things I'll accept).

 

[Markmightbite]

365 have refunded the turners bets

 

[Leman14]

SkyBet have voided Turners bets.... but not refunded Free Bets....

Not sure if I should expect them to, but if the bet is VOID, it should be irrelevant whether it's cash or Free Bets... surely...
(Or do I expect too much... :beaten


Edit/update - under settled bets.. its says "your Free Bet stake has been returned"... but it hasn't...yet...

 

[Exar Essay]

SkyBet have voided Turners bets.... but not refunded Free Bets....

Not sure if I should expect them to, but if the bet is VOID, it should be irrelevant whether it's cash or Free Bets... surely...
(Or do I expect too much... :beaten


Edit/update - under settled bets.. its says "your Free Bet stake has been returned"... but it hasn't...yet...

Any idea what they are doing with the WTAFs? I placed a reasonable sum on the Gallaghers/Turners special.

 

[TigerRolllllll]

SkyBet have voided Turners bets.... but not refunded Free Bets....

Not sure if I should expect them to, but if the bet is VOID, it should be irrelevant whether it's cash or Free Bets... surely...
(Or do I expect too much... :beaten


Edit/update - under settled bets.. its says "your Free Bet stake has been returned"... but it hasn't...yet...

Assume u mean in mults?

Tjey should have voided the Turners part of the bet, but the other legs still stand as bets …hence no refund

single free bets are normally returned

 

[Black Dog]

I'm very much in favour of a Turners handicap as long as it retains a terrestrial tv slot and it's grade 1 prize pot(100k). The best can still target it as long as its worth it.

 

[Markmightbite]

And BETFAIR

 

[Min The Merciless]

Coral refunded my singles Turners bets yesterday. I guess any multis will just have the Turners selection removed, leaving any others in play.

Sadly doesn't look as though they've refunded any of their 'Specials' as of yet. Ballyburn for the Turners at 16s (placed 1st Feb) still showing in open bets. Got an IEP one too

 

[Runragged]

Why does everyone think Bally goes Arkle?

Assuming he goes chasing (might not), then the target is surely 2026 Gold Cup, which as Willy has said he is bred for & owner wants

Seems an odd way to get there teaching a horse all the wrong things as a novice ….its a diff style of jumping altogether for 2m & 3m plus

it is Willie ….but having already won Gallagher, seems more logical to campaign over 2.5m over fences and gradually build to 3m

Markets do say Arkle, but I know some tipsters have also gone with my logic above

I would say it is how Mullins has previously campaigned his Gold Cup horses. GDC never ran over 3m as a novice and went Golden Miller, Al Boum Photo never won over 3m and though did go BANC the yard had Invitation Only and Kemboy for the shorter format (and Kemboy started the 2019 GC a shorter price than ABP). Djakadam went Golden Miller, not racing at 3m as a novice.

There are exceptions, Don Poli and Monkfish are two over the years, but in both cases they were horses who were strong stayers over hurdles. Don Poli only won at 2 1/2m over hurdles as it was the Martin Pipe and had been held up off the frenetic pace. Monkfish shortest distance he won at over hurdles was 2m 6f.

Arguably none of those mentioned went Arkle, but in all those times there was the option of 2 1/2m novice to run in, plus how many would of won a Supreme which on all known form, Ballyburn would of done?

In my mind a bigger BANC field will probably result in a stronger pace and more of a stamina test then we have generally seen in recent years and I just don't think Mullins wants to put his potential Gold Cup horses through that, not when you have a horse who has the pace for 2m.

Saying all this, I wouldn't be taking the 3/1 about Ballyburn for the Arkle just yet. If one or two others from the yard prove strong at 2m then could Ballyburn skip Cheltenham altogether? He also improved a great deal from his first run last year that he could hit a bigger price early on.

I've waffled enough...

 

[OverTheLast]

And BETFAIR

Has the Exchange voided them?

 

[OverTheLast]

I would say it is how Mullins has previously campaigned his Gold Cup horses. GDC never ran over 3m as a novice and went Golden Miller, Al Boum Photo never won over 3m and though did go BANC the yard had Invitation Only and Kemboy for the shorter format (and Kemboy started the 2019 GC a shorter price than ABP). Djakadam went Golden Miller, not racing at 3m as a novice.

There are exceptions, Don Poli and Monkfish are two over the years, but in both cases they were horses who were strong stayers over hurdles. Don Poli only won at 2 1/2m over hurdles as it was the Martin Pipe and had been held up off the frenetic pace. Monkfish shortest distance he won at over hurdles was 2m 6f.

Arguably none of those mentioned went Arkle, but in all those times there was the option of 2 1/2m novice to run in, plus how many would of won a Supreme which on all known form, Ballyburn would of done?

In my mind a bigger BANC field will probably result in a stronger pace and more of a stamina test then we have generally seen in recent years and I just don't think Mullins wants to put his potential Gold Cup horses through that, not when you have a horse who has the pace for 2m.

Saying all this, I wouldn't be taking the 3/1 about Ballyburn for the Arkle just yet. If one or two others from the yard prove strong at 2m then could Ballyburn skip Cheltenham altogether? He also improved a great deal from his first run last year that he could hit a bigger price early on.

I've waffled enough...

No chance he skips Cheltenham

 

[Leman14]

Assume u mean in mults?

Tjey should have voided the Turners part of the bet, but the other legs still stand as bets …hence no refund

single free bets are normally returned

No - in multi's they have just voided that leg and it remains in open bets with the other legs left to run. (correctly)

In Settled Bets - I have three single bets on Impaire Et Passe in the Turners (all with Free Bets) - they have been voided and under each bet, it says "Bet settled as void. Your £X Free Bet has been returned)

(BUT - they haven't been refunded..... yet)

 

[Odin]

I would say it is how Mullins has previously campaigned his Gold Cup horses. GDC never ran over 3m as a novice and went Golden Miller

Galopin won the 3m novice stayers hurdle at Punchestown, which may have been outside the UK season but still counts as his novice hurdle season to me. Never more than 2m5.5f over fences though if that's what you meant :encouragement:

 

[Runragged]

Galopin won the 3m novice stayers hurdle at Punchestown, which may have been outside the UK season but still counts as his novice hurdle season to me. Never more than 2m5.5f over fences though if that's what you meant :encouragement:

Yes, was talking more about how Mullins has campaigned his GC horses at shorter than 3m in their novice chase season.

 

[Leman14]

SkyBet - Voided bets

IF you have used Free Bets on the Turners market with SkyBet (for singles) - you will need to get in touch with SkyBet Help.....

They refunded the Free Bets, but because they were placed in April - the expiry date had passed (obviously....) and weren't showing as "available" to use.
(This was never a problem when Sky's Free Bets had no expiry date!)

If you get in touch with Sky - they SHOULD make them available with a new 7 day expiry date.
They have just done this for me "as a gesture of goodwill"...

Good luck!

 

[Craigy14]

I’m also very much in the Arkle camp for Ballyburn, even prior to the Turners being removed.

Let’s not forget the pace he has shown in bumpers and over hurdles. He slammed the Supreme winner 7 lengths over 2m. As Runragged says, which makes sense now, the BANC could be a brutal affair now with larger field etc so WPM may take the 2m route and then up him in trip post Cheltenham.

Then there’s the possibility he stays over hurdles, which I think many would be surprised and upset with that decision :boxing::biggrin-new:

 

[Ice]

I’m also very much in the Arkle camp for Ballyburn, even prior to the Turners being removed.

Let’s not forget the pace he has shown in bumpers and over hurdles. He slammed the Supreme winner 7 lengths over 2m. As Runragged says, which makes sense now, the BANC could be a brutal affair now with larger field etc so WPM may take the 2m route and then up him in trip post Cheltenham.

Then there’s the possibility he stays over hurdles, which I think many would be surprised and upset with that decision :boxing::biggrin-new:

I've had £20 of free bets back off bet365 from Ballyburn in the Turners.