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AI vs Cheltenham (Punter or Really a Plonker)

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Hi All

Thanks for your interest in this thread. Designed to be for non techies also. For those that have fully adopted AI into their Cheltenham annual system , want to or just want to do it in paralell .
Call it a trial thread ready for next year when we know what to expect and what this eventually turns out to be. Maybe nothing.

Lets just mention areas where we have played with it , i dont mean in casual day to day punting. This is specifically for what i call the "larger Cheltenham project"

As I mentioned, I use AI almost hourly and have done for a few years within my industry - but I have purposely this year kept it apart from my traditional system. DONT FIX WHATS NOT BROKEN!


However im eager to understand what I could of done, should of I created a parallel mini test to see the outcome on a smaller scale.
Has anyone done this, or replaced their setup completely. Feel free to use the thread just for potential ideas - COLLABORATION :)

Just a heads up, I wont be , have not put a single penny of AI views into my portfolio. Its purely just exploring use cases.
 
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Feel free to post interesting insights you have found, models you have created, picks you have gone heavy into with your projects or LLM outcomes.

Balance is key. Depending on how many hours you put into it traditionally or using new techniques then it could be super time saving.
Some people like me may enjoy the traditional methods and time spent and actually PROFIT from that fun of research - rather than any returns or not. Let see where it takes us.
 
Because it's on topic currently, ChatGPT, yes, the basic of AI models to ask, gave me the following Champion Hurdle 1-2-3.

1. Constitution Hill (if he runs)
2. The New Lion
3. Brighterdaysahead

Not exciting, and no good for my bets!

I know a couple of here have some proper models, as @Zachx02 has said in the 'General' thread, he can offer his up, which I would find interesting.
 
I asked ChatGPT to pick the winner of the county based on historical data, trends, weight etc.... and it gave me the below which is plausible.
  1. Puturhandstogether
  2. Murcia (the class/Mullins override)
  3. Hamlet’s Night
  4. Kopeck De Mee
 
I asked ChatGPT to pick the winner of the county based on historical data, trends, weight etc.... and it gave me the below which is plausible.
  1. Puturhandstogether
  2. Murcia (the class/Mullins override)
  3. Hamlet’s Night
  4. Kopeck De Mee
Can you imagine getting the tricast and it paying £1.50
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Odddog
I asked ChatGPT to pick the winner of the county based on historical data, trends, weight etc.... and it gave me the below which is plausible.
  1. Puturhandstogether
  2. Murcia (the class/Mullins override)
  3. Hamlet’s Night
  4. Kopeck De Mee
Did you direct it where to pull the trends from in your prompt?
 
Rooster - I couldnt stop laughing reading about your 60 year old AI post about "what the duuck they on about" LOL.
So my traditional OLD STYLE bet spreadsheet is still being used , but it can really assist with analysing my spreadsheet in terms of me telling me automatically what horse will be my biggest winners and then my ideal profitable outcome in each race. IE: say i backed poniros at 66/1 20s and 15s , golden ace ew at 20s and 16s and then the brighterdaysahead pacemaker ew. It would tell me all the permutations financially of each result. Such a simple way to use it without much damage. Just hooking an LLM up to a spreadsheet. Then it also tells me what races ive staked the least on etc and what races ive spent way to much on
 
@darlojim will be in clover, ChatGPT has said Roc Dino wins the Martin Pipe!
 
So i just did something (because i think something could be imminent ) i took a screenshot of oddschecker 30 mins ago and sent the screenshot to gemini pro.
Asked it to predict the market if Con hill is ruled out :


HorseCurrent OddsPredicted New OddsMovement
The New Lion11/46/4 FavBecomes the clear market leader for Dan Skelton.
Brighterdaysahead3/17/4The "Smart" money choice; likely to challenge for favoritism.
Lossiemouth6/13/1Massive move if she is confirmed to skip the Mares' race.
Golden Ace7/14/1The reigning champ moves into "serious contender" territory.
Poniros16/110/1Your 66/1 longshot from the file suddenly looks like a live EW player.
 
If you're going to be using LLMs, I'd suggest using Gemini or Claude for the actual analysis, but asking chatgpt to make the prompt beforehand

Something like - "I am going to ask an LLM to predict the winner of the Martin pipe conditional jockeys handicap hurdle at Cheltenham, can you make a very detailed prompt which analyses many different areas ranging from pedigree, ratings (timeform, RPR, etc), yearly trends of winners in the race upon others things", and this is the prompt I got given


You are a specialist National Hunt racing analyst. Your job is to predict the most likely winner of the 2026 Martin Pipe Conditional Jockeys’ Handicap Hurdle at Cheltenham and produce a ranked shortlist with reasoning grounded in verifiable evidence and domain logic.
0) Non-negotiable rules
Do not hallucinate facts. If a specific detail (e.g., a horse’s rating, recent run, pedigree fact) is genuinely not publicly available or not widely published, state “Unknown” and do not invent any numbers or facts.
For every factual claim, you must clearly indicate the source type (e.g., “Timeform published rating,” “recent Racing Post RPR,” “Cheltenham past performance trend,” “historical trends”) in the reasoning.
Distinguish clearly between reliable evidence and general handicapping heuristics.
1) Race background and characteristics
Include a brief summary of the race that covers:
Distance and course profile (Cheltenham’s uphill finish and test of stamina/turn of foot)
Handicap nature (large field dynamics, importance of getting a rating mark right)
Conditional jockeys allowance effect (how allowances interact with high OR horses)
2) Entry list & field context
Without me providing any specific list, use what is publicly known about the 2026 entries — including names, trainers, jockeys, weights, official ratings — as the basis for your analysis. If entries changed or the field is still provisional, note uncertainty.
3) Key analytical dimensions (for every runner)
For each runner in the declared field, evaluate the following:
A) Ratings quality
Official Rating (OR): Where it sits in relation to the typical competitive band for past winners
Timeform rating (if publicly published)
Raceform/RPR (if available)
Compare best published figures (RPR/Timeform) to OR to estimate whether the horse is well-handicapped, over-marked, or under-marked.
For every rating claimed, explicitly cite it (e.g., “Timeform rated this horse 142 on 08/02/26”).
B) Recent form
Last 3–5 runs
Distance and class of those runs
Strength of competition
Finishing positions and margins
Indicators of suitability to a fast pace / testing 2m4f
If any form component is unknown or unavailable, mark it as “Unknown.”
C) Historical trends and statistical priors
Use well-published trends (past winners since 2000, typical age, weight etc.) and clearly indicate:
Which trends have solid statistical backing
Which are tenuous or potentially spurious
Example trend categories (but not limited to):
Age profile of winners
Official rating range that historically does well
Weight carried range
Run last time performance (e.g., beaten < lengths/placed/returned 1st)
State clearly which trend information you used and where it came from (e.g., “based on past 10 years Cheltenham results analysis”).
D) Pace and race shape
Evaluate likely race shape:
Front runners (cited from entries or known running styles)
Hold-up horses
Impact of the conditional jockey allowances on pace judgment
Whether a strong pace could favor stamina types
E) Ground suitability
Assess each horse’s known form on the anticipated going (e.g., Soft, Good to Soft) and known preferences from past performances. If unsettled weather is expected, include how well each profile handles cut in the ground.
F) Trip & Cheltenham profile
Consider:
Proven ability beyond 2m
Evidence of stamina for the Cheltenham hill
Jumping reliability
Tactical adaptability
Again, for facts you claim here (e.g., “ran well up the Cheltenham hill last April”), cite the performance source if publicly documented.
G) Pedigree (supporting, not primary)
Only use pedigree when it has demonstrable connection to performance (e.g., sire with strong staying handicap profile). Do not over-interpret; if no strong pedigree signal exists, mark “Pedigree: Neutral / Unknown.”
4) Scoring framework
For each horse, generate a scorecard with the following categories (0–10 each):
Form & recent performances
Ratings and handicap value
Trip + Cheltenham suitability
Pace position and tactical fit
Ground suitability
Connections/conditional jockey execution
Trend conformity (age/weight/rating band)
Also include a short justification (1–2 sentences) for each category.
Then compute an aggregated total score (0–70).
5) Final output structure
Your response must include:
(a) Ranked forecast
A table with the top 6 runners sorted by overall score, including:
Horse name
Key figures (OR, best public rating, last 3 results summary)
Total score
Brief rationale for ranking
(b) Predicted winner
Name the most likely winner
Provide the 3 strongest supporting factors
Provide the 2 biggest risks
Likelihood estimate (e.g., “High confidence,” “Moderate,” “Low”) with justification
(c) Alternative scenarios
Explain how your ranking would materially change if:
The going turns softer/heavier than expected
The pace becomes significantly stronger or weaker
Any key runner is withdrawn
(d) Data gaps & uncertainty
List specific important data that would improve your prediction (e.g., final RPR figures, sectional timings, confirmed going) and how that information would adjust confidence if available.
6) Reliability grading
For the overall prediction, include a short confidence grade (A/B/C) based on availability and strength of underlying data.
 
Rooster - I couldnt stop laughing reading about your 60 year old AI post about "what the duuck they on about" LOL.
So my traditional OLD STYLE bet spreadsheet is still being used , but it can really assist with analysing my spreadsheet in terms of me telling me automatically what horse will be my biggest winners and then my ideal profitable outcome in each race. IE: say i backed poniros at 66/1 20s and 15s , golden ace ew at 20s and 16s and then the brighterdaysahead pacemaker ew. It would tell me all the permutations financially of each result. Such a simple way to use it without much damage. Just hooking an LLM up to a spreadsheet. Then it also tells me what races ive staked the least on etc and what races ive spent way to much on
Okay cool. I really like that. I’m almost too ashamed to tell you I’m using an A4 pad I bought from Tesco (got the Club Card reduction though) 👴
 
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So i just did something (because i think something could be imminent ) i took a screenshot of oddschecker 30 mins ago and sent the screenshot to gemini pro.
Asked it to predict the market if Con hill is ruled out :



HorseCurrent OddsPredicted New OddsMovement
The New Lion11/46/4 FavBecomes the clear market leader for Dan Skelton.
Brighterdaysahead3/17/4The "Smart" money choice; likely to challenge for favoritism.
Lossiemouth6/13/1Massive move if she is confirmed to skip the Mares' race.
Golden Ace7/14/1The reigning champ moves into "serious contender" territory.
Poniros16/110/1Your 66/1 longshot from the file suddenly looks like a live EW player.
With respect, that has to be complete bollocks and why you should probably do your own work rather than rely on machines.
The predicted odds for those five equate to an overound of 130%, if it was a five runner race that would be poor in bookmaking terms, but there will be more runners than push that overound to what, 160/170% and very likely higher ?
That market just wouldn't exist....
 
Closer than having to wait on Cheltenham, I asked both Gemini and CHATGPT who would be its top two in today's highest value handicap, which happens to be the 4.00 at Bangor.

I got the same answer. Jacks Parrot followed by De Legislator. They are both sort of joint 2nd favs behind Planned Paradise although it's still more than 5 hours to tapes up.

I can only assume they've gone for a mix of top rated and tipster tips?
 
Just a heads up, I wont be , have not put a single penny of AI views into my portfolio. Its purely just exploring use cases.
I could of trained up a model over the past 12 months, linking it to GaulStats, results, history of hte past 12 years, linked it and embedded trainer quotes you name it. Then it would be a smarter beast at deciding on the above. This is literally the equivalent of me going to tesco and using the quickest answer possible and getting the nearest loaf of bread to the exit rather than analysing all the brands and prices.
 
Great idea for a thread. I used AI a few weeks ago to try and predict the likely Prestbury Cup score. I always like having a punt on this market but have previously done it manually with pen, pad and calculator. The feeds were the latest betting for each race along with racecards showing which were UK and Ireland runners, asked it to work out a % of each winning per race and then normalise to take out the overrounds. Probably saved me about 2 hours effort. AI (Co-pilot) prediction was 19.6 Ireland v 8.4 UK...
 
Closer than having to wait on Cheltenham, I asked both Gemini and CHATGPT who would be its top two in today's highest value handicap, which happens to be the 4.00 at Bangor.

I got the same answer. Jacks Parrot followed by De Legislator. They are both sort of joint 2nd favs behind Planned Paradise although it's still more than 5 hours to tapes up.

I can only assume they've gone for a mix of top rated and tipster tips?
Generally it's pretty crap for day to day punting I've seen really, the only use I've had outside of extended prompts like the one I posted above which is basically just a stats scraper is for my personal day to day betting on US racing where I can just ask it to break down the pace of a race rather than doing it myself, and it's generally quite accurate
 
I asked ChatGPT to pick the winner of the county based on historical data, trends, weight etc.... and it gave me the below which is plausible.
  1. Puturhandstogether
  2. Murcia (the class/Mullins override)
  3. Hamlet’s Night
  4. Kopeck De Mee
Did it ask you to enter the weights and odds .. it told me to add those when I entered the trends for the ultima the other day.. not tried it yet though