Stupid Questions

[Deleted member 4957]

Has anyone actually 'forked out' the 75 pounds (90 on Gold Cup day) to 'take advantage of' the early bird offer for Club tickets!

Good to see you BoF, hope you’re well.

The festival has become a beast as we know. every day is either a sell out or very nearly a sell out so their pricing structure isn’t putting people off, remember there are tens of thousands of people who pay 5/10/20 times face ticket value to get into other major sporting events and music events and after a year of no such enjoyment you can bet there’ll be higher demand than ever as lockdowns ease.
75 quid for what is 6+ hours entertainment doesn’t scream poor value, I happily pay near 100 quid for international cricket tickets which are also all day events , and there are plenty of people of shell out similar sums for a 90 min game of football every other week.
All that said I became a member and will attend the vast majority of meetings on offer, not so easy to
do from Boston I accept...

 

[Lobos]

Has anyone actually 'forked out' the 75 pounds (90 on Gold Cup day) to 'take advantage of' the early bird offer for Club tickets next year. If you're mad or desperate enough, then please rush to the Cheltenham site before 7th April.
It used to be that you had until September at the lowest price but it is getting earlier and earlier. And, once again, there is no apparent/easy way of finding out how many more increments before they end up at the outrageous 'day of races' price.
I say all of this despite the admission costs being a fraction of what it costs me to fly over (which I will do anyway just to have the craic) - it's just the principle!
After 30 years, my group is seriously considering other options next year - we certainly didn't miss the crowds this year!

Have already purchased early bird tickets in the Best Mate enclosure for all 4 days. Incredible value for money.

 

[Garrison Savannah]

I’m not annoyed by the pricing*, I am annoyed you can buy a maximum of 6 tickets (my group is 7). I know it’s easy to get around and I know it’s a supposed attempt at stopping the touts, but it’s still annoying.

*Same as Ista, the ?75 is cheaper than Ashes tickets for example which I guess is a decent comparison in terms of both the length of the day and the pinnacle of each sport. I think the cheaper prices in Tatts and Best Mate is ridiculously cheap. Though maybe unlike others I don’t think Club is really worth the price difference (albeit I pay it as I still think ?75 is good value).

 

[The Giant Bolster]

I've got a potentially stupid question about how long horses take to recover from a race. You sometimes hear that a race has come too soon after another for a horse even after 3-4 weeks (or sometimes more). This feels a bit odd since a person could recover easily within that time from a 4-7 minute hard effort.

So is it that horse physiology is different or is it psychological (horses need time to forget what a hard effort feels like) or something else?

 

[BigBucksFlatSpot]

I presume some horses recover quicker than others like humans but it's a good question....because I've never seen the actual data or analysis...in cycling or athletics you would get info on how long people were in the redzone and their recovery times...via tracking and monitoring

Horses would be harder but it would be good to know if that analysis and science is applied by trainers or if its more gut feel ...it feels like it's the latter

 

[Atlantic Viking]

a person could recover easily within that time from a 4-7 minute hard effort.

Speak for yourself! :dejection::highly_amused:

 

[Quevega]

I've got a potentially stupid question about how long horses take to recover from a race. You sometimes hear that a race has come too soon after another for a horse even after 3-4 weeks (or sometimes more). This feels a bit odd since a person could recover easily within that time from a 4-7 minute hard effort.

So is it that horse physiology is different or is it psychological (horses need time to forget what a hard effort feels like) or something else?

The correct phrase would be that the race MAY have come too soon.
As it's guesswork.
Like most excuses given for a horse not winning, or running to form.

The trainer shouldn't really run them if they think the horse is not fully recovered from a previous race. So it's particularly annoying when trainers use this phrase.

I'd imagine that trainers can use methods to test if a horse appears fresh again, before returning to race again, and all horses will differ in how they handle racing, and obviously it also depends on how hard the previous race was or not.

Obviously most athletes require recovery time to be at their best when they race again.

 

[The Giant Bolster]

I presume some horses recover quicker than others like humans but it's a good question....because I've never seen the actual data or analysis...in cycling or athletics you would get info on how long people were in the redzone and their recovery times...via tracking and monitoring

Horses would be harder but it would be good to know if that analysis and science is applied by trainers or if its more gut feel ...it feels like it's the latter

The "horse psychology" must make it a lot harder I think. Cyclist and athletes can do things like interval training to improve 4-7 minute efforts but they involve a lot of suffering. They can put up with it since they know it improves performance but obviously a horse couldn't rationalise that and - I guess - develop a reluctance to "go deep".

 

[Stormez]

I tend to think of that as a bullshit excuse given when a horse underperforms. They take regular blood tests, and that would tell them all they need to know with regards to whether he’s fully recovered or not.

 

[intheshuck]

One Cool Poet won three races at the 2019 Galway Festival on the Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. Amazing achievement.

 

[DenmanSacre]

One Cool Poet won three races at the 2019 Galway Festival on the Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. Amazing achievement.

And then raced in 2 races in 2 days the following month, winning one of them.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

I’m convinced there was a horse who won on successive days at the Aintree festival many years ago, probably around 89/90, haven’t a clue what races or what his name was though...

 

[Freyno]

I’m not annoyed by the pricing*, I am annoyed you can buy a maximum of 6 tickets (my group is 7). I know it’s easy to get around and I know it’s a supposed attempt at stopping the touts, but it’s still annoying.

*Same as Ista, the ?75 is cheaper than Ashes tickets for example which I guess is a decent comparison in terms of both the length of the day and the pinnacle of each sport. I think the cheaper prices in Tatts and Best Mate is ridiculously cheap. Though maybe unlike others I don’t think Club is really worth the price difference (albeit I pay it as I still think ?75 is good value).

Garrison, I've emailed The Jockey Club with regards to the maximum of 6 tickets, they've informed me its due to current rule of 6 guidelines and they will start accepting group bookings once the rule of 6 guidelines are dropped, hope this helps.

 

[Faugheen_Machine]

I’m convinced there was a horse who won on successive days at the Aintree festival many years ago, probably around 89/90, haven’t a clue what races or what his name was though...

Battle Group won on the Thursday and Saturday a few years ago. The first over hurdles, then over fences.

 

[Garrison Savannah]

Garrison, I've emailed The Jockey Club with regards to the maximum of 6 tickets, they've informed me its due to current rule of 6 guidelines and they will start accepting group bookings once the rule of 6 guidelines are dropped, hope this helps.

Thanks Freyno, very good of you Sir

 

[Cheltenham Novice Chase]

A couple of general questions, which I’ve never been quite sure about. If anyone knows the answers that would be very much appreciated.

1) I’m aware a horse needs to run in three races in the relevant discipline in order to secure a handicap mark but if the horse falls or unseats the rider in one of those three races does is still count as one of the three required races?

2) If a race only has a maximum number of runners and receives more declarations than there are places, how is it decided which horses can run? What if many horses at the cut-off point have the same handicap mark? How are marks which include penalties for races won post the allotment of the mark treated versus normal handicap marks?

 

[Spectre]

A couple of general questions, which I’ve never been quite sure about. If anyone knows the answers that would be very much appreciated.

1) I’m aware a horse needs to run in three races in the relevant discipline in order to secure a handicap mark but if the horse falls or unseats the rider in one of those three races does is still count as one of the three required races?

2) If a race only has a maximum number of runners and receives more declarations than there are places, how is it decided which horses can run? What if many horses at the cut-off point have the same handicap mark? How are marks which include penalties for races won post the allotment of the mark treated versus normal handicap marks?

The answer to the first question is the handicapper will usually give a mark if the fall was over the last two fences. They are allowed to defer if they so wish though.

The answer to the second is by ballot, usually done in advance. If a horse wins and gets a penalty which puts it on the same mark as others in the ballot to get in, said horse is automatically last choice.

 

[Cheltenham Novice Chase]

The answer to the first question is the handicapper will usually give a mark if the fall was over the last two fences. They are allowed to defer if they so wish though.

The answer to the second is by ballot, usually done in advance. If a horse wins and gets a penalty which puts it on the same mark as others in the ballot to get in, said horse is automatically last choice.

Thanks Spectre. It’s hard to find this info on the BHA website and I knew someone on here would know. Much appreciated.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

I’ve always understood that a trainer can ask the handicapper to consider a run if the horse failed to make it to the second last.
I know trainers can ask for overseas form to be used/considered if a horse doesn’t have the three required starts...

 

[Spectre]

I’ve always understood that a trainer can ask the handicapper to consider a run if the horse failed to make it to the second last.
I know trainers can ask for overseas form to be used/considered if a horse doesn’t have the three required starts...

They can Istabraq. It's not often they'll get given a mark, but it does happen ocasionally if the handicapper feels he as sufficient handle on a horse already. It rarely happens for top end horses though, simply because the handicapper is concerned about catching a cold in a higher profile Saturday handicap.