Free Bets

[archie]

Not sure where to put this but most seem to use 'free' bets for Cheltenham so...

When is a 'free bet' not a free bet? From my own very limited experience, there are 3 main categories:

- based on turnover like the Sky Bet Club. Bet £25 in a week and get a £5 free bet.
I'd argue that this is only a free bet if you normally spend £25+ a week betting and that you make a profit on that.

- special offers from a bookie eg. bet £10 in a particular period and get a 'free' £10 bet to be used in a (fairly short) period of time. Typical Betfair Sportsbook offer.
Surely only a free bet if you were going to have the original bet anyway.

- race specific offers. If X wins a particular race, all losing bets qualify for a 'free' bet. Typical Paddy Power offer.
Again, surely only a free bet if you were going to have the original bet anyway.

I'll freely admit that I bet very little - £25 a week will get you 4% of a horse with Willie Mullins - but are there any other 'free' bet offers that are more reliable and actually free?

 

[Hurricane fly]

I suppose the only true free bet is when you sign up with sky(or atleast it used to be) and get a £20 free bet no deposit required. William Hill scratchcard has given a couple of free bets out too with no conditions.

All the joining offers are “bet £10 get £30 free bets” etc. Which again requires an initial bet

Personally I use three or four different bookies and will have a check to see if anyone is offering free bet offers. If I’m making the bet already and get something I consider it a free bet.

 

[archie]

Cheers HF. I meant to include joining offers but they are nearly all based on turnover.

 

[Leman14]

Not sure where to put this but most seem to use 'free' bets for Cheltenham so...

When is a 'free bet' not a free bet? From my own very limited experience, there are 3 main categories:

- based on turnover like the Sky Bet Club. Bet £25 in a week and get a £5 free bet.
I'd argue that this is only a free bet if you normally spend £25+ a week betting and that you make a profit on that.

- special offers from a bookie eg. bet £10 in a particular period and get a 'free' £10 bet to be used in a (fairly short) period of time. Typical Betfair Sportsbook offer.
Surely only a free bet if you were going to have the original bet anyway.

- race specific offers. If X wins a particular race, all losing bets qualify for a 'free' bet. Typical Paddy Power offer.
Again, surely only a free bet if you were going to have the original bet anyway.

I'll freely admit that I bet very little - £25 a week will get you 4% of a horse with Willie Mullins - but are there any other 'free' bet offers that are more reliable and actually free?

As you will see from my recent “book”post on the AP thread.. I use Free Bets....... a lot!!!!

I mostly use Sky and WH and place bets strategically in order to make best use.
I keep track of my annual betting and (fortunately) make a profit each year.
My Sky turnover does exceed £25 each week, BUT only with bets that I would normally place.

With special offers for World Cup / Ryder Cup, I would normally back a Top Scorer or Tournament winner, so it’s just a case of choosing the bookie that give you the best Free Bet offers. (Unless a vastly lower price as a result)

Another good source of potentially sizeable Free Bets is WH “2 clear”.
Again, I won’t back a horse unless I fancy it BUT if they win by 2 lengths or more, you get 15% Free Bet

In short, there is rarely such a thing as a a Free Bet BUT if you generate one on the back of your normal betting patterns, then no worries!!

 

[Kevloaf]

I apologise in advance for this post as it might come a bit preachy and arrogant

Firstly, I'd point blank say that there are no "free" bets. I actually go on a rant whenever I get chance about it... not just in bookie offers, but everyday life. Companies advertise "Buy one get one free"... well that isn't FERE is it... it is just a 'good value deal'. Unless you can literally walk in to a shop and take it, without exchanging anything at all in return IT IS NOT FREE. I lose my rag with anyone that doesn't understand that concept. Now that shouldn't be confused by me saying "nothing is free", because some things are... a supermarket giving away free samples/tasters, is free. It also doesn't mean when something is advertised as "free", that I don't think it's good value... which leads me nicely on to "free bets"

They are not free (HF is right that incredibly rarely you get a "free bet with no desposit required" - which technically is free, however there is usually a play through that you need to get throiugh which makes them less valuable.

I personally do like to 'collect' free bets where I can.

In the opening post, point one mentions Skjy and their £25 stake, get a £5 free bet. Now I bet around £200-400 a weekend generally so I easily go over that without even thinking about it. I do have access to 4 slybet accounts at the moment though and I don't use any but my own for these "free bet club". Similarly, PaddyPower do 5x £10 bets and you get a £10 "free bet". I don't always use PP but lean that way if I remember to.... I still chase the best price rather than ones I know will get me a 'free bet'. However, the amount I stake a weekend doesn't make it that difficult to hit the qualifiers for those bets.
I should make it clear though, that I am profitable weekend-to-weekend, so I am not losing £25 and then £50 with Sky and PP just to get £15 worth of free bets. I see them 100% as a bonus, I never use them for anything during the weekend/week that I'm betting on, so they are never factored into my returns.

The method I do more actively 'search' for free bets is with the "money back if loses" offers. Mainly with Sky. The first ITV race is usually the offer and I'll always start my weekend punting by concentrating on that race on a Friday night (perhaps it is second after whatever the 'big race' of the weekend is) Now I don't always bet in the race... I still have to fancy the selection however if I am brutally honest, if I don't have a strong selection, I would perhaps just put the £20 on the fav and it's an on-going joke I have with a couple of my friends that we actually want it to come 2nd for the "Cheltenham bet". I haven't actually got accurate stats on the money back races, but I'd be staggered if I hadn't had more winners and "free bets" than losers, let alone actual decent price winners. I do also have the luxury of having 3 extra accounts I can use, so when I really fancy one I can increase the stake. (I am actually a bit annoyed Ista gets £50 for the same consession but imagine that is based on my staking history, as I've only really increased stakes in the past 18 months)

I find the PP ones "if horse X wins you get money back" or "if you come 2nd to blah money back" to be rubbish value. I feel like that usually is me giving £10 away to get a £10 free bet, and I always try and think "would I stake £10 on Cheltenham now instead" - and often that'd be yes. I'd need to really want to oppose a favourite to use the PP "free bet" offer and to be honest £10 isn't a big enough stake for me to have a normal bet on now, so I'd just look for the bigger price.

Every single weekend I aim to make a profit (well done Captain Obvious) - and I pick up free bets where I can to use on Cheltenham to help me with my quite specific approach of backing multiple horses / building a book / increasing returns on very strong selections / covering horses I am too scared to put my 'real money on'

For me, "free bets" are the bi-product of me successfully punting, and not my main focus. I do like the free bets because it'll effectivly and significally 'skew' the festival for me. What I have in my bank account on the Monday before Cheltenham compared to the Monday after will be affected by landing some "free bets". I am just lucky that I can cover the 'losses' that have provided the free bets during the season whilst still making a profit.

 

[Leman14]

I apologise in advance for this post as it might come a bit preachy and arrogant

Firstly, I'd point blank say that there are no "free" bets. I actually go on a rant whenever I get chance about it... not just in bookie offers, but everyday life. Companies advertise "Buy one get one free"... well that isn't FERE is it... it is just a 'good value deal'. Unless you can literally walk in to a shop and take it, without exchanging anything at all in return IT IS NOT FREE. I lose my rag with anyone that doesn't understand that concept. Now that shouldn't be confused by me saying "nothing is free", because some things are... a supermarket giving away free samples/tasters, is free. It also doesn't mean when something is advertised as "free", that I don't think it's good value... which leads me nicely on to "free bets"

They are not free (HF is right that incredibly rarely you get a "free bet with no desposit required" - which technically is free, however there is usually a play through that you need to get throiugh which makes them less valuable.

I personally do like to 'collect' free bets where I can.

In the opening post, point one mentions Skjy and their £25 stake, get a £5 free bet. Now I bet around £200-400 a weekend generally so I easily go over that without even thinking about it. I do have access to 4 slybet accounts at the moment though and I don't use any but my own for these "free bet club". Similarly, PaddyPower do 5x £10 bets and you get a £10 "free bet". I don't always use PP but lean that way if I remember to.... I still chase the best price rather than ones I know will get me a 'free bet'. However, the amount I stake a weekend doesn't make it that difficult to hit the qualifiers for those bets.
I should make it clear though, that I am profitable weekend-to-weekend, so I am not losing £25 and then £50 with Sky and PP just to get £15 worth of free bets. I see them 100% as a bonus, I never use them for anything during the weekend/week that I'm betting on, so they are never factored into my returns.

The method I do more actively 'search' for free bets is with the "money back if loses" offers. Mainly with Sky. The first ITV race is usually the offer and I'll always start my weekend punting by concentrating on that race on a Friday night (perhaps it is second after whatever the 'big race' of the weekend is) Now I don't always bet in the race... I still have to fancy the selection however if I am brutally honest, if I don't have a strong selection, I would perhaps just put the £20 on the fav and it's an on-going joke I have with a couple of my friends that we actually want it to come 2nd for the "Cheltenham bet". I haven't actually got accurate stats on the money back races, but I'd be staggered if I hadn't had more winners and "free bets" than losers, let alone actual decent price winners. I do also have the luxury of having 3 extra accounts I can use, so when I really fancy one I can increase the stake. (I am actually a bit annoyed Ista gets £50 for the same consession but imagine that is based on my staking history, as I've only really increased stakes in the past 18 months)

I find the PP ones "if horse X wins you get money back" or "if you come 2nd to blah money back" to be rubbish value. I feel like that usually is me giving £10 away to get a £10 free bet, and I always try and think "would I stake £10 on Cheltenham now instead" - and often that'd be yes. I'd need to really want to oppose a favourite to use the PP "free bet" offer and to be honest £10 isn't a big enough stake for me to have a normal bet on now, so I'd just look for the bigger price.

Every single weekend I aim to make a profit (well done Captain Obvious) - and I pick up free bets where I can to use on Cheltenham to help me with my quite specific approach of backing multiple horses / building a book / increasing returns on very strong selections / covering horses I am too scared to put my 'real money on'

For me, "free bets" are the bi-product of me successfully punting, and not my main focus. I do like the free bets because it'll effectivly and significally 'skew' the festival for me. What I have in my bank account on the Monday before Cheltenham compared to the Monday after will be affected by landing some "free bets". I am just lucky that I can cover the 'losses' that have provided the free bets during the season whilst still making a profit.

What he said!!!
You put it so much better than I could Kev..

 

[Kevloaf]

What he said!!!
You put it so much better than I could Kev..

Sorry didn't see your post. The WH +2 offer is one I always forget about. WH seems to be lower down my pecking order and I never really think about distances...but probably should. I tend to gravitate towards 365.

Speaking of 365 (and betfair) do the ITV offer, of if you back a winner at 4/1 (or 3/1 with Betfair) you get your money back (not as a free bet, but actually back) if you lose in the next race. That is an offer a friend of mine exploits hugely as he just lays off for certain profit... although it doesn;t seem worth it to me!

 

[Leman14]

Sorry didn't see your post. The WH +2 offer is one I always forget about. WH seems to be lower down my pecking order and I never really think about distances...but probably should. I tend to gravitate towards 365.

Speaking of 365 (and betfair) do the ITV offer, of if you back a winner at 4/1 (or 3/1 with Betfair) you get your money back (not as a free bet, but actually back) if you lose in the next race. That is an offer a friend of mine exploits hugely as he just lays off for certain profit... although it doesn;t seem worth it to me!

As with your points above Kev, the 2 Clear Offer is great, BUT as always - only if you are planning to back that horse anyway.
It’s best to see “Free” Bets, as a Bonus

 

[archie]

Thanks for the responses gents.

Just to add that I deliberately started a new thread because it was and is a general question. Had I posted in a current thread it might have looked like a pop at whoever had just posted. Most on here have been at the game long enough to know the wrinkles but it does no harm to stand back and take stock occasionally.

 

[Rhinestone_Cowboy]

Love the phrase 'farming' of free bets Lehman that you used on the other thread. As mentioned a few times now I farmed my whole Cheltenham outlay last year (2k) by laying off the qualifying bets so the 2k was free in a real sense. Since then have lost free bet offers (and restricted) with 3 bookies although it is not clear if that is directly related to farming, it may also to do with winning a few quid and getting the price on Hugh Taylor tips. Have a few quid to play with this year so won't be doing it quite so religiously. That said I hope free bets will still make up a big part of my ante-post book, helped by a friend giving me access to all his losing accounts

 

[ComplyOrDie]

Love the phrase 'farming' of free bets Lehman that you used on the other thread. As mentioned a few times now I farmed my whole Cheltenham outlay last year (2k) by laying off the qualifying bets so the 2k was free in a real sense. Since then have lost free bet offers (and restricted) with 3 bookies although it is not clear if that is directly related to farming, it may also to do with winning a few quid and getting the price on Hugh Taylor tips. Have a few quid to play with this year so won't be doing it quite so religiously. That said I hope free bets will still make up a big part of my ante-post book, helped by a friend giving me access to all his losing accounts

Best way to go about it IMO. Some of my original accounts were restricted because I was meeting just the qualifying amounts so I started doing 'muggy' looking bets to also lay off, so even if I was losing £1 overall, I am still getting a £5 bet out of it, it may not be free, but if someone offered you £5 for £1 every week you'd take it for sure, over a year that is £208 profit, in bets, and that's worst case, some cases I lose less than £1 and at times have made little bits from it too.

You certainly don't need to waste say £25 to release a £5 bet, if you are smart enough about it.

 

[Faugheen_Machine]

I have heard that some bookmakers use software that can detect if the exchanges are open on your computer when you place a bet with them. Not sure it's legal but it's a way that they can identify potential arbers.

 

[ComplyOrDie]

I have heard that some bookmakers use software that can detect if the exchanges are open on your computer when you place a bet with them. Not sure it's legal but it's a way that they can identify potential arbers.

Yes, I heard rumours of this a while back now, which is why I always use laptop for one and a desktop PC, my phone or tablet for the other Always ways around it IMO.

Need to be careful with bookmakers though, obviously PP/Betfair are together, Ladbrokes/Coral/Betdaq are owned by the same company too, plus some of these smaller bookmakers are owned by some of the larger companies too.

Former SkyBet owner, Hestview Ltd, also owned Sportinglife and Oddschecker, obviously companies that can be used to push certain products/bets, what with write ups of so called, experts etc....

 

[robith]

Kev's wanting the freebet tale is making me laugh. I put £20 on Frodon in one of those free bet races on Sky and was gutted when he won as I had £140 in real money and I wanted that, rather than a Cheltenham free bet haha

 

[Deleted member 4957]

Whether you consider these bets free or otherwise make the most of them while you can, bookmakers will restict you all at some point and the option of securing best price/value/incentive won’t exist sadly...

 

[KingSprinterSacre]

Kev's wanting the freebet tale is making me laugh. I put £20 on Frodon in one of those free bet races on Sky and was gutted when he won as I had £140 in real money and I wanted that, rather than a Cheltenham free bet haha

Haha! I had him in the same race with skybet. Fancied him but was toying with not doing the bet then seen sky were offering money bacl for 2nd and 3rd. Cheltenham back in Jan think i got him around 15/2

 

[Brital]

Whether you consider these bets free or otherwise make the most of them while you can, bookmakers will restict you all at some point and the option of securing best price/value/incentive won’t exist sadly...

I got the dreaded Dear John from Sky last week. No more free bets, no more guaranteed odds & severely restricted stakes.

I remember someone on here suggesting sprinkling in footy bets along with racing ones as a way to throw off their algorithms.
Ironically in my case I think a streak of winning bets on the football may have been my downfall.
As you say though it was always going to happen eventually, just a matter of when.

 

[Deleted member 4957]

I got the dreaded Dear John from Sky last week. No more free bets, no more guaranteed odds & severely restricted stakes.

I remember someone on here suggesting sprinkling in footy bets along with racing ones as a way to throw off their algorithms.
Ironically in my case I think a streak of winning bets on the football may have been my downfall.
As you say though it was always going to happen eventually, just a matter of when.

Probably me Brital, sorry to hear it didn't work.
I know there are bookmakers who target punters who don't bet on football as they're seen as specialists/professionals, so it's unlikely to be winning football bets that have cost you the account.
For what it's worth I now throw in mug bets on other live TV sports, rugby and French/German football, live games only so you look like a crackhead punter betting on anything you can watch, but I'm down to the final two accs so I need to be ultra careful, if these go I am win singles only on the exchange with no ability for multis....

 

[Brital]

Probably me Brital, sorry to hear it didn't work.
I know there are bookmakers who target punters who don't bet on football as they're seen as specialists/professionals, so it's unlikely to be winning football bets that have cost you the account.
For what it's worth I now throw in mug bets on other live TV sports, rugby and French/German football, live games only so you look like a crackhead punter betting on anything you can watch, but I'm down to the final two accs so I need to be ultra careful, if these go I am win singles only on the exchange with no ability for multis....

It may also have been the consistent way I used my free bets to only bet on next years Cheltenham.
I probably should have mixed it up a bit more the way MoM has with his.

Down to only two accounts, that’s a sad indicator of the bookmaking industry.
Sky is the second one to shut me down after PP last year, so I’ve a bit more wiggle room. Good luck keeping them active!

 

[Kevloaf]

It may also have been the consistent way I used my free bets to only bet on next years Cheltenham.
I probably should have mixed it up a bit more the way MoM has with his.

Down to only two accounts, that’s a sad indicator of the bookmaking industry.
Sky is the second one to shut me down after PP last year, so I’ve a bit more wiggle room. Good luck keeping them active!

I don't think its the "free bets" on Cheltenham, I've done that consistantly and I'm live...

I'm most wary about how open I am on this forum than my betting patterns :highly_amused: