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2017 Cross Country Chase

I'm not a CoC fan in this. his forte is stamina and you need agility and balance ahead of stamina.
I can't see the interest...
 
Completely different code though. Saying "Cheltenham brings out the best in him" is completely correct, but not relevant for this race.

If he was tailed off in that race over C&D LTO, and running in the Kim Muir or Ultima, I would be backing him! I am not backing a horse who has run once over this C&D and who came a disappointing 5th beaten 42L, after clearly not taking to the first 4 or 5 obstacles.

At 10/3 it is an embarassing leap of faith. (Getting closer to saying he can win but the price is wrong) but I will stay stubborn :highly_amused:
 
I cant argue he's short mate... completely agree. Couldnt consider backing him at 10/3. And of course I can understand why you are against him based on his one run over the Banks.

But I just couldn't rule him out completely. The two fields he faced at the Festival the last two years look infinitely more competitive than what he will be up against this time around. I dont think its completely irrelevant to say he's shown his best form in spring at Cheltenham myself, even if it is a different code. They know how to train him to peak for the Festival.

Balthazar King only had won run in this code over C&D (albeit a slightly better one) before winning this race.
 
CCM - banks races are entirely different, far more obstacles that come far quicker, and the course runs inside the main course its' entirety so no galloping straights, all twists and turns, they only get racing when they come out onto the racecourse proper 3f from home so CoC stamina doesn't come into play.
Over the years it's paid to stick with the experienced campaigners in banks races...
 
Ista. I am aware of how banks races are run cheers :)

But CoC is being talked about as if hes Just So! He had plenty of very good form as a 2 miler in his younger days.. I just think he's no old slowboat just because he stays well.

And I don't think connections are doing this solely with the GN in mind myself.
 
As a two time festival winner, if he wasn't in the Grand National this year, do you think he'd be running in this race CCM?

If I hadn't alrady had a bet in this race, looking at the market today I would definitely be backing Auvergnat each way at 8/1!

UR at Chelt isn't ideal, but he got pretty close to Cantlow on his first attempt over the cross country fences and has a win to his name, looking like he'd improved quite a bit. Best work late on and at Cheltenham was going well before the UR incident.

Is Urgent De Gregaine still a likely runner?
 
COC will be my lay of the festival at these prices - it's absolute lunacy that he is so short.

I can't see how his style of running is suited to the x country. The obstacles will come far too quick for him and I can see him being right out the back early on and stuggling to get into any sort of rhythm.

Easily the worst price of the festival as things stand.
 
Last I heard they were 50/50 mate I think. Haven't heard anything since.

I think Bless The Wings is still value at 14/1. Although Cantlow beat him comprehensively, he will be 10lb better off, is only 12 (not that old for this race!) and ran a blinder last year.

I just think its a race severely lacking in quality horses, and whilst it is a speciality discipline to some extent, I dont think it would take extensive schooling for a decent quality animal, who jumps well, to be a big player in it. Third Intention made his banks debut in this race last year and was probably the only horse not experienced in the whole field, yet finished 4th. As I mentioned before, Balthazar King proved that experience wasn't vital if you had the aptitude for it when he won. Likewise Rivage d'Or, who I think had also only had one run over Banks fences, prior to winning this.

As for your initial question, I dont really know tbh. His mark would make it very tough for him in the handicaps I suppose, so I guess they were short on options. They must have wanted to come to the Festival with him as he has proved he likes it there. And presumably connections must think this will suit him. If they merely want a blow out to put him spot on for the GN, surely there were countless other options than this?

But I do agree the value has long gone.
 
Kevloaf said:
I think I asked about Usual Smurfer earlier on in this thread actually and someone had some info...
Click to expand...

Of the others I'm starting to like this one.
Is this one definitely heading this way ?
 
I took some 16s earlier but have Cantlow in just about every multiple bet I've placed, could run very well though this one
 
Old Vic said:
Think Shark give him as a charity bet at early previews
Click to expand...

Shark put usual smurfer up as his charity bet at our preview night
He put 25 each way at 33s for the charity
Shark used to train this horse,but it was moved when the owner put all his horses with Alan Fleming
 
Not one I'd backed but I did pan to in the day.

Good news for Cantlow fans
 
Not a race I spend much time on but have to say Sausalito Sunrise is very interesting. His handicap mark has come down 11 pounds (and he's still joint top OR), he's been lumping top weight in good handicaps but is now off levels in this and if he takes to these fences he could be different class. The Hobbs team knows what it takes to win this race and at 12/1, on ground he will enjoy, he has to have a real chance. Put it like this: if he can reproduce his close 3rd in the 3m 5f Bet365 Gold Cup last April (off 159) he will win this easily!
 
What is the stat about horses having their first go in this? That'd put me off? I would like them to have a spin first? PLenty of good horses have had a go and not transfered it to this discipline?
 
Istabraq said:
Horrific...
Click to expand...

Well.....Balthazar King (same stable) had run over the course just once before he won this race. That was in December when he was disputing 2nd before being carried out before the last. Rivage D'or had not run over the course (or any Banks course) when he won in 2015. Lacdoudal, also trained by Hobbs (there's a theme here) finished a 5l 3rd in the 2010 running on his first attempt.
 
Yes BOF, Rivage D'Or hadn't contested a banks race before but he remains the only winner of this race to have done so, for win purposes it pays to stick to those who have demonstrated a liking for the course.
There have been winners of the Nov and Dec race who were making their banks debut.
 
I did a bit of research on this the other day, and I thought horses making their debut actually came out pretty well overall. Can't see enough evidence to suggest it's a big negative myself.
 
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