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Queen Mother Champion Chase 2021

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  • Originally posted by Jorvik View Post

    Ha hopefully, but it is Henderson we're talking about...
    Horse might fracture an eyelash and get pulled

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    • Hoping from an antepost perspective Altior pisses up tomorrow so gives a chance to get a bit on Chacun before Sunday.

      No doubt Chacun wins that Sunday and goes very short indeed.

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      • If Altior disappoints tomorrow and Chacun wins well on Sunday then say goodbye to anything above 9/4. With his declaration proving his well being, I'm going to get him onside hopefully by doubling him up with Banker Easysland and then hope and pray he gets there !

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        • I just don't understand the confidence behind Chacun Pour Soi, i've just watched the 3l defeat of Min back in February and wasn't particularly impressive visually, didn't seem to have much left by the line. The year before this, Min won the same race, then found himself 11l behind Altior at the festival.

          A couple of months before he gets beat by a cautious jumping A Plus Tard and again looks like a horse who doesn't find an awful lot in a finish.

          In the interests of fairness and in his defence, the defeat of Defi Du Seuil at Punchestown is much more pleasing visually (time looks decent too) on a more testing track than Leopardstown, but we know an awful lot more about Defi now and inbetween then and this years disasters, his 3 wins were all infront of the usual faces and an 11/12 year old Un De Sceaux, one by a neck.

          I'm in danger (well, i've gone past it at this point I suppose) of rubbishing CPS, which isn't the case, I can see where people are coming from with him. I suppose my real issue is with the prices, I just can't have him as short as he is compared to Altior, especially when there's just as many question marks. I think it's the race that fascinates me most so far, it's not too difficult to imagine one or both failing to turn up and even if they do, I think the value is very much with those who have PTKO at double figure prices. The more I look at it, the more I feel the latter is being criminally overlooked and underestimated, again.




          .

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          • Originally posted by Jorvik View Post
            I just don't understand the confidence behind Chacun Pour Soi, i've just watched the 3l defeat of Min back in February and wasn't particularly impressive visually, didn't seem to have much left by the line. The year before this, Min won the same race, then found himself 11l behind Altior at the festival.

            A couple of months before he gets beat by a cautious jumping A Plus Tard and again looks like a horse who doesn't find an awful lot in a finish.

            In the interests of fairness and in his defence, the defeat of Defi Du Seuil at Punchestown is much more pleasing visually (time looks decent too) on a more testing track than Leopardstown, but we know an awful lot more about Defi now and inbetween then and this years disasters, his 3 wins were all infront of the usual faces and an 11/12 year old Un De Sceaux, one by a neck.

            I'm in danger (well, i've gone past it at this point I suppose) of rubbishing CPS, which isn't the case, I can see where people are coming from with him. I suppose my real issue is with the prices, I just can't have him as short as he is compared to Altior, especially when there's just as many question marks. I think it's the race that fascinates me most so far, it's not too difficult to imagine one or both failing to turn up and even if they do, I think the value is very much with those who have PTKO at double figure prices. The more I look at it, the more I feel the latter is being criminally overlooked and underestimated, again.




            .
            If I remember correctly the time for his defeat of Min was very impressive despite the visuals now backing it up.

            I personally think it’s a massive statement Townend going to Cork for the ride on Chacun when the John Durkan and the valuable mares race with Finest Evermore is at Punchestown on Sunday. You get the feeling they have the bit between their teeth on Chacun after his unlucky injury on the morning of the race last season and I expect him to win this easily.

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            • If altior does retain a significant amount of his ability chacun will need to be a good 2 or 3 lengths in front jumping the last

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              • Originally posted by Lobos View Post
                If Altior disappoints tomorrow and Chacun wins well on Sunday then say goodbye to anything above 9/4. With his declaration proving his well being, I'm going to get him onside hopefully by doubling him up with Banker Easysland and then hope and pray he gets there !
                A potentially clever double could be whatever selection you fancy to usurp Altior in the Tingle Creek, doubled with Chacun Pour Soi ante post for the QMCC.

                The logic being, Altior is current second fav but will get pushed out if beaten and will no longer look the most credible rival, and whatever beats him is unlikely to go shorter than CPS and if CPS wins in Ireland (likely), he'll get trimmed, so you really get to maximise the potential market shift between the current CPS and Altior prices.


                Of course, picking the Tingle Creek winner isn't easy, and of course, Altior may not lose!



                One for people to think about though if they don't fancy Altior.


                I am not off the fence so I won't be doing it, but I still think it's clever

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                • Originally posted by AnFiieLD. View Post
                  If I remember correctly the time for his defeat of Min was very impressive despite the visuals now backing it up.
                  4m 11.40s on yielding ground
                  Min won it in 2018 on soft in 4m 12.40s with the 2nd 12l back. Min was eased down towards the line.
                  Last edited by Jorvik; 4 December 2020, 01:44 PM.

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                  • Mullins entries in the Cork Grade 2 in recent times:

                    2019: Cilaos Emery (1st) (Cheltenham '20: 4th, Champion Hurdle)
                    Great Field (UR) (C'20: PU, Grand Annual)
                    2018: Great Field (UR)
                    2017: Un De Sceaux (1st) (C'18: 2nd, Ryanair)
                    2016: Douvan (1st) (C'17: 7th, Champion Chase)
                    2015 Abandoned: Felix Yonger, Twinlight (Neither went to the festival)
                    2014: Felix Yonger (1st) (No Cheltenham entry, 1st '15 Punchestown Champion Chase)
                    Twinlight (PU) (6th in same race as Felix Yonger)
                    2013: Twinlight (1st)

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                    • Originally posted by Kevloaf View Post

                      A potentially clever double could be whatever selection you fancy to usurp Altior in the Tingle Creek, doubled with Chacun Pour Soi ante post for the QMCC.

                      The logic being, Altior is current second fav but will get pushed out if beaten and will no longer look the most credible rival, and whatever beats him is unlikely to go shorter than CPS and if CPS wins in Ireland (likely), he'll get trimmed, so you really get to maximise the potential market shift between the current CPS and Altior prices.


                      Of course, picking the Tingle Creek winner isn't easy, and of course, Altior may not lose!



                      One for people to think about though if they don't fancy Altior.


                      I am not off the fence so I won't be doing it, but I still think it's clever
                      Yep, good point. I think Altior may still win tomorrow though without looking good as Politilouge is always better in the spring and ran really poorly in the TC last year. Altior is miles clear of anything else so he would have to run a stone below his best to be out of the money.
                      Last edited by Lobos; 4 December 2020, 03:34 PM.

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                      • Originally posted by Lobos View Post

                        Yep, good point. I think Altior may still win tomorrow though without looking good as Politilouge is always better in the spring and ran really poorly in the TC last year. Altior is miles clear of anything else so he would have to run a stone below his best to be our of the money.
                        think politologue was poorly in the race last year, bled i think.

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                        • Originally posted by Lobos View Post

                          Yep, good point. I think Altior may still win tomorrow though without looking good as Politilouge is always better in the spring and ran really poorly in the TC last year. Altior is miles clear of anything else so he would have to run a stone below his best to be our of the money.
                          After training Politologue for 5 years PN says he now realises the horse runs best fresh and given rest between races. Last year he started in the Schloer and was beaten 1 1/4l by DDS giving him 3lb. He then ran disappointing in the TC but it was only 3 weeks later. This year fresh on soft ground (more rain please) will be interesting

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                          • Originally posted by Pendil View Post

                            After training Politologue for 5 years PN says he now realises the horse runs best fresh and given rest between races. Last year he started in the Schloer and was beaten 1 1/4l by DDS giving him 3lb. He then ran disappointing in the TC but it was only 3 weeks later. This year fresh on soft ground (more rain please) will be interesting
                            Be good if he could make the race really competitive as we need to find out if Altior really retains his ability

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                            • Altior a non runner tomorrow

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                              • Originally posted by FaugheenTheMachine View Post
                                Altior a non runner tomorrow
                                Saw this - strange that the markets and the exchange hasn’t reacted?

                                EDIT : now they have - jumped on Greanateen & Politologue before they changed
                                Last edited by Topofthegame2021; 4 December 2020, 08:57 PM.

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