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Why Are We Doing It?

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  • Why Are We Doing It?

    I look at the Festival as something that produces an annual dividend. I recycle my stake plus 50% of my profits for the following season, and take out 50% of my profit to spend on something specific. Usually I take the family away for a nice holiday each year, and have a second ‘boys’ holiday. One day I expect I’ll give the pot I’ve built to my (adult) kids away from the prying eyes of the taxman. I’m curious though what you guys do with any winnings, and how you control how much you invest antepost? And do you have an endgame, or something specific you’re trying to achieve?
    Luck is a dividend of sweat. The more I sweat, the luckier I get.

  • #2
    Myself it's more enjoyment than the financial aspect. I'm not a big drinker and don't smoke so don't really have any expensive hobbies. Love thinking about cheltenham every day and happy parting with some money doing that.

    This will be very different to everybody else but I never really count my antepost betting towards a profit loss (that may change this year as I've staked a lot more). Normally I still do a fair bit of betting on the week so I only count that - the antepost money would've only been spent on some other nonsense the Mrs wants anyway. My aim normally on the week is to simply break even. If I've not lost anycmoney and watched the best weeks racing of the year then I'm more than happy.

    Last year was the first year I've won a decent amount of money and breached 250 points profit. Having only been in my first house for 4 months it was nice to clear out a bit of debt and spend what was left doing a fair bit of my garden defevlopment. This year's target is 200 points profit (hence if anyone's read my very boring diary I'm aiming at 30 points on my main fancies - with my stakes I simply can't get it higher than that without - therefore I'd need about 7 winners for the 200 points profit). 200 points would clear the rest of my garden and then anything on top will go into the wedding/honeymoon fund.

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    • #3
      A good few questions Spectre.

      I started off as a bit of fun, and although it still technically is fun it is also something I become accustomed to making fair amounts of money on over the past 6-7 years at least. I didn't have the best 2016-17 festival but enough was made, along with the seasons betting, that I almost paid for my 6 week Australia trip at the end of 2017 and through the beginning of 2018. Since the 2018 festival I've managed to put away 200-300pts every festival for the following seasons festival, plus put money away. The collective amounts of profit from 2018-2019 festivals, along with my own saving has meant I, along with my partner managed to secure our first property together, the deposit mostly secured from profit made at the festivals though. Since then we've had our little boy, so family life has well and truly taken over. I'm interested to see how I get on this time around, as it has definitely been a lot more difficult to keep up to date with news, missing potential cash out opportunities, as well as missing out on some decent prices for some horses or specials that now look very good, but such is life.

      I have no end game, unless I completely cop out one season and have a complete disaster that I have to start from scratch, though I find it hard to believe this will happen given the 'creating a book' style that I currently choose to do. Even if I somehow copped a life changer I'd probably still continue with how I do things, without changing my stakes, as I'm at a comfortable level right now.

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      • #4
        For me it was always just about the love of the week and the racing, I'd had the odd antepost bet but nothing ever really serious until I came on here. I'm 25 in a few weeks and and although racing is my passion 100%, I'd a hectic enough last 6-7 months moving into a flat and stuff so the punting bankroll wasn't really there for a massive season this year or antepost wise. There is a lot to be learnt on this forum - I don't really bet on the flat at all - so my plan is save and create my bankroll during the summer coming and have a proper betting bank for next season and then be able to build a real, good antepost Cheltenham book next year .. one where I will look to make a real profit and see it as an investment.

        As a side note - I do a bit of laying and place betting on Betfair on the side at weekends and during the week when work allows, I make enough at it to think I could have a crack down the line and doing it full time - providing the bankroll is there I believe it's achievable. Due to a family bereavement in the past few months I'm looking at a decent sum and am genuinely thinking about it. Does anyone here do it? There is no way I'll go through life without having a crack at it full time at one stage. I am in a job I kind of do for the money, see no future in it at all as I don't enjoy it - but it's having the balls to try go and back yourself to make the living... I guess I shouldn't have fucked up the job I had in a 'raceroom' head office for quite a large Bookmaker ..

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        • #5
          Originally posted by OverTheLast View Post
          For me it was always just about the love of the week and the racing, I'd had the odd antepost bet but nothing ever really serious until I came on here. I'm 25 in a few weeks and and although racing is my passion 100%, I'd a hectic enough last 6-7 months moving into a flat and stuff so the punting bankroll wasn't really there for a massive season this year or antepost wise. There is a lot to be learnt on this forum - I don't really bet on the flat at all - so my plan is save and create my bankroll during the summer coming and have a proper betting bank for next season and then be able to build a real, good antepost Cheltenham book next year .. one where I will look to make a real profit and see it as an investment.

          As a side note - I do a bit of laying and place betting on Betfair on the side at weekends and during the week when work allows, I make enough at it to think I could have a crack down the line and doing it full time - providing the bankroll is there I believe it's achievable. Due to a family bereavement in the past few months I'm looking at a decent sum and am genuinely thinking about it. Does anyone here do it? There is no way I'll go through life without having a crack at it full time at one stage. I am in a job I kind of do for the money, see no future in it at all as I don't enjoy it - but it's having the balls to try go and back yourself to make the living... I guess I shouldn't have fucked up the job I had in a 'raceroom' head office for quite a large Bookmaker ..
          Betting with a salary is VERY different to betting without one. Those financial pressures suddenly kick in when you have a losing day/week/month - I know it because this has been my life this year!
          Last edited by dannycraigpirates; 2 January 2021, 12:55 AM.

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          • #6
            For me, this year is very different. I’ve had to start a book much later than I had hoped, and on a reduced amount, adding 100 points per month from here on in at most. From my diary you can see it’s weighted to about 50% singles at this stage.

            When I was more reckless, it was solely multiples through the winter, and large singles on the week. Paid for some very expensive holidays and a bit of time off work without financial stresses. Ultimately, back to back 2000+ point winning festivals and nothing to show for it today, apart from some very good memories!

            Moving forward though, maybe it’s my somewhat jealous, somewhat competitive nature that will see me try to emulate the books of people on here at a much earlier stage next year - my concern like most, is it’s getting harder to keeping accounts open. I’m limited at present to basically Hills, Coral & Unibet for myself & therefore am reliant on a good friend allowing me to place bets in her account. I’m trying to much more risk averse, backing several in each race to mitigate liabilities. What my end game is though, it’s hard to say. I’m 34. I live and rent in Central London. I’m single with no children, so the lack of financial responsibilities is there which means I could reinvest any winnings back into next year’s festival - the only issue is Covid basically lost me all my clients and now struggling to find work - so I might have to take profits to live off. It’s a catch 22 in that respect.

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            • #7
              My aim is always to pay for my yearly golf membership

              Don't always manage it, often not close, but last 3 years iv done it

              Hopes mainly hanging on shiskin/envoi free bet doubles this year

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              • #8
                Originally posted by dannycraigpirates View Post

                Betting with a salary is VERY different to betting without one. Those financial pressures suddenly kick in when you have a losing day/week/month - I know it because this has been my life this year!

                Indeed. Much tougher mentally when it is your only source of income. Especially in these times, where people are getting laid off and losing hours left right and centre, and it may well become your familys only income.

                ****** Why Are We Doing It?



                Obviously I'm a big fan of the sport, and enjoy the build up as much as the week itself, i wouldn't spend as much time as I do if that wasn't the case.

                But first and foremost The reason I bet antepost on chelt, is that, it is potentially extra income,

                The same question a few years ago, of what I bet on chelt for... it would have been a different answer, property, family car, holidays a few luxury items, and stress free cash in the bank.


                These days, it wouldn't be the above, I'm trying to pay for education for my son, and potentially a property ready for by the time he is 18, so gives me 16 years to do so.

                I have banked what I have already earned previously, and My stakes are massively down from last year onwards to protect that, so that time line should be about right in theory.


                What i also earn from my site (minus taxes, fees, and expenses) goes straight into my sons bank account.
                And that will be the same for anything that I have accrued through chelt antepost.


                It's harder and harder to get on, for the next few years, I can literally only do so in shop, on terminals, which rules me out of alot of bets I would want to make, but atleast I can still advise them. Which obviously gives me satisfaction and interest that way, and in turn allows me to effectively earn from them, in a round about way via subscriptions.

                On betting related income in general ....

                I try to earn outside of chelt a reasonable ammount so that covers basically my running costs and salary that I pay myself, for bills .....
                ideally without dipping into personal funds.
                I think most know what my 1 pt is, so they will literally be freely able to see in the daily bets section, a good portion of how much I have earned or not, long term throughout the year.


                *****
                Long way of answering, but in short, to give my son the head start I never had.
                https://scooby91horseracingtips.com/
                Use code "FJ" in your sign up name for bonus content!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I dont make a book or get overly serious about it all..i have a good idea of where im at by the end of the week in regards to what i bet and what was returned but im never too serious about it because end of the day you win some and you lose some and its nags! They can be flat out mental sometimes so the potential to have a mare is easy!..ive certainly never looked at it as a “genuine” money making opportunity, but since i started betting on the cheltenham festival ive never not been in profit...thats not me being flash at all because what i bet is probably pennies to most of you all on here, usually scores on singles & doubles very rarely do i work up the bollocks to put more then a bullseye as a single unless im pissed and falsely confident! But what it seems to be with that week is that most horses tend to run to form so it makes life a little easier, so with a fair bit of information through this forum and twitter etc, you can hazard a decent guess on who will be there or thereabouts, so thats where the place betting is always good for me personally so i feel theres much better chances this week then any other point in the year.. i suppose the reason i love it so much is because the potential to land a life changer is always there with this extra information available wether its true or not its just how i always feel and im a bit of a dreamer..you read about some mad bets landing for people and a part of me (when i place an ante post multi) always thinks “this is the one” apart from that i just enjoy the races win or lose the only thing that gets on my tits is when your main pick just doesnt show up or give you a run for your money, id rather lose by a photo finish then watch my horse pull up halfway round


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                  • #10
                    a thought provoking thread

                    I am doing it because I live in cheltenham and have been caught up with festival fever more and more over the last 10 years. a good friend of mine introduced me to national hunt and since then I've not looked back.

                    that 10 years ago I'd spend most of my money on drinking with mates in pubs and trying to save a bit for a house

                    now I've got a young family, and so have a lot of of my close friends, so this is the main thing we spend our spare change on.

                    I do it because its a hobby I love and I am learning more and more about the different races each year. I started just on championship races and thanks to this forum I now look at beginner chases in October and maiden hurdles with much greater interest that I ever thought I would. and in enjoy the sport much more because of that.

                    I've now a small stake in a horse that appears particularly difficult to train but can see me getting involved more in ownership as kids grow up.

                    I enjoy what I call fun bets and some on here would call mug bets...the 100-1 request a bets for example..as I like to dream about the big one!

                    this is my second year of putting in the work ante post and aim being to be able to treat the kids to something nice. last year it was a bike and Nintendo switch so you can see I'm a small stakes punter!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by fatherjohn View Post
                      a thought provoking thread

                      I am doing it because I live in cheltenham and have been caught up with festival fever more and more over the last 10 years. a good friend of mine introduced me to national hunt and since then I've not looked back.

                      that 10 years ago I'd spend most of my money on drinking with mates in pubs and trying to save a bit for a house

                      now I've got a young family, and so have a lot of of my close friends, so this is the main thing we spend our spare change on.

                      I do it because its a hobby I love and I am learning more and more about the different races each year. I started just on championship races and thanks to this forum I now look at beginner chases in October and maiden hurdles with much greater interest that I ever thought I would. and in enjoy the sport much more because of that.

                      I've now a small stake in a horse that appears particularly difficult to train but can see me getting involved more in ownership as kids grow up.

                      I enjoy what I call fun bets and some on here would call mug bets...the 100-1 request a bets for example..as I like to dream about the big one!

                      this is my second year of putting in the work ante post and aim being to be able to treat the kids to something nice. last year it was a bike and Nintendo switch so you can see I'm a small stakes punter!
                      the bit in bold I highlighted is so true.


                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I see it as a Hobby and as I'm not into the flat I used to say it was only 6 months a year but to be honest these days next year will start on March the 20th (maybe before with envoi and shiskin 2022).

                        I'm a small stakes punter - I cover quite a few horses in a race and supplement it with mug lucky 15s and request a bets. I'm always chasing a big one but I known the odds that seem so generous have more often than not proved to be right afterall. I probably make as much from the single bets at longer antepost prices. I used to bawk at betting 10 pound antipost on a horse and then seemingly have no problem putting 50nin an online slot machine ...so I've reigned in the latter

                        I know I'll 'win' some money as i cover a number of options and i use the money to pay for next years bets and for cheltenham membership...anything else is a bonus ..last year was a fridge and the year before a laptop ...its rock and roll.

                        Above all I like the analysis and the chance to solve a puzzle - I feel different fundamentally from winning a horse bet versus a slot. . The stakes aren't big enough to be much more and I get a thrill from analysing and being proved right (or wrong) I love reading about the stables, reading the time and sectionals and then applying an eyeball test. I've a couple of friends who are equally as obsessed - its a game of opinions and thats half the fun too

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I have been obsessed with Cheltenham since 1999. In the early days I'd save all year just so I had a pot to gamble with during the week.

                          During the last 10 years I've started doing almost all of my Cheltenham betting ante post. The first year I attempted it I'd lost 42% of my bank to non runners , it was disastrous but I still made a profit so it was enough to convince me to keep going.

                          I've had 1 losing year in the last 10 and Cheltenham profits have bought me a car, holidays and helped reduce my mortgage.

                          The dream is to pay off the mortgage and that's why I keep doing a load of multiples. Failing that, if I can get a family holiday or two out of the profits and keep growing the betting bank then I'm happy.

                          The lazy line you hear in the racing media is that ante post betting is dead. That suits me fine, as I know it to be the complete opposite.

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                          • #14
                            I do it because it's one of the addiction's I enjoy.

                            Like many others I enjoy the build up and discussion, and the working it all out as much as the races themselves.
                            I don't get over excited when I win and don't get too down when I lose, so mentally I'm well equipped. I worry about the people that do.

                            Financially (at 49) I'm fortunate to not have many commitments, as my daughter has moved out and earns more than me already.
                            I'm also perfectly happy with a simple life and do not have the kind of materialistic mind that makes people crave more than what they really need.
                            I think it's called Drive and Ambition
                            I worked out that's the fast track to disappointment and unhappiness for 99% of people a long time ago.

                            The small company I own and run, requires about 2 hours a day (4 days a week) of my time.
                            So, as a house husband with a catering degree in Home Economics, I can spend hours a day on the horses.

                            I have had a five figure Bank on and off for the last few years and have not really had to fund this for several years, although every now and then I will take funds out (usually after Cheltenham & Aintree) and inject money in, when I get a bad run (usually mid summer).


                            I probably spend as much time as some professionals, but would never take it up seriously as I simply do not have the discipline as I bet on far too many races, due to having the time to do it and I also lack the Balls and psychology (to back myself).

                            I'm generally risk averse, having worked in financial investments all my life, I prefer my clients to make between 5-10% per year and any that want to double their money in a year are shown the door. When you try to win big, you increase the chances of losing Big. That's not for me, as I enjoy this so much I would not want to lose my bank and have to use the surplus income I have, which is going into Pension funds at the moment.

                            My average unit stake is less than 0.2% of my Bank, and I will probably only stake around 30-50% of My Bank on Cheltenham.
                            Sadly my turnover due to the numerous bets I make is over 6 figures consistently now. Which is quite frankly ridiculous.
                            Last edited by Quevega; 6 January 2021, 01:28 PM.

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                            • #15
                              Revenge - lost a lot of money as a young man (not so much on sports betting), won it back and then some over last 4 years in no small part to the great folk on here which I’m massively grateful for. I really don’t care for the money as such as just give any winnings to my wife/family just love taking it from the bar stewards who massively contributed to making my early adult life more challenging than it should have been.

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