2017 Champion Chase

[gjt7756]

I think the problem they have with Vatour is that he clearly doesn't thrive in the winter months, he always comes back with a heavy condition on his first run doesn't run up to form for a couple of races but as soon as he gets better ground and going left handed he becomes a different animal, almost untouchable as we have seen the last 3 years at Cheltenham, the issue is they are more or less forced into sending him to kempton for the King George, it's not the harshest but a good test at 3 miles and against class field with other gold cup contenders in it, so it's one of the few options to gage his stamina but it's just at the wrong time of year for him, although I agree you can't really knock the form of his very narrow defeat to cue card, a horse that was tanking in the gold cup and as ruby said if he held on to him for a little longer before going for home there was every chance he wouldn't have got caught, I think they owe it to the horse, the punters and themselves to give the gold cup a go, and win or loose they wouldn't loose anything by trying, the horse has his black type already and a 3 time festival winner...

[Kevloaf]

I do to be honest, I think a nose second is good enough to have another go and I don't think Douvan will be aimed for the King George either.

Douvan picked up all the 2 miler chases this year and there isn't any reason they wouldn't take the easier option of the Champion Chase. Mullins and Ruby would be happy to win it and Douvan is young enough to step up in trip later on. No rush with him, especially when they don't have a ready made replacement for the CC. Last season Mullins said he could move Killultagh Vic to the Arkle so I suppose that is one option.... BUT, when Vautour was second by a nose and gets 2 miles 5 at Cheltenham and Douvan has the 2 mile division seemingly at his mercy, there doesn't seem to be a need to see if Douvan is a Gold Cup horse this year...

[paz247]

I want to see what they do with Champagne Fever this season, his past couple of runs were to bad to be true, and Mullins has admitted to not being entirely sure what to do with him, hopefully with a good summer on his back and a full season we will see the true CF again, the one that won the bumper and the supreme and lost out in a thrilling arkle by the shortest of nose, 9yo now but I'm sure there is one big race left in him

[Kevloaf]

Seems obvious that he should race over 2 miles when you put it like that doesn't it. They tried to get the King George trip with him didn't they a couple of years back?

Maybe if Douvan DID step up in distance they'd think about CF for this? I am a fan but I think in this race he'd struggle to keep up with Sprinter Sacre for starters.

[paz247]

A friend of mine would like to see him contest the World Hurdle, I think he will go Ryanair if he turns up fit and well at the Fest unless Ricci fires two bullets at the ChampChase

[gjt7756]

To be fair when we are discussing targets for these big horses of Mullins, douvan, Vatour, Djakadam etc. we should be taking into account as well the likes of killultagh Vic and black Hercules, even thouhg riccis horses are more dominant in the yard I think these horses could have an impact on targets as well come the fes, it is going to be a very interesting season for Mullins with what I think is one of his biggest and strongest yards this season as to how they will all be campaigned, I think a lot of them are going to have to be double entered and run in the same races, I mean how could you keep the likes of them apart come the fes, I think throughout the season you'll see them all split up with more than ever coming to England, which by the way makes me want to punt Willie for the trainers title!! there's only so many races at a certain distance come cheltenham....

[Kevloaf]

CF for the World Hurdle? Does your friend know something we don't? They always said he was a scopey, chasing type and the King George was too far?

[Kevloaf]

gjt - He is probably already favourite for the title isn't he? Not my kind of bet to wait a year at around evens but better than any interest rates I suppose.

Killultagh Vic is going to be really interesting and I think with the depth this year, they will have two live shots at quite a few races. Ruby will have some tough choices and leave the second strings slightly over priced. If Killultagh Vic turned up anywhere with a Ricci one he'll be a bit over priced

[Istabraq]

KV is a potential star but will be placed to avoid the Ricci horses in my opinion which means he could very well become the next Champagne Fever and up in races he shouldn't be in.....

[Kevloaf]

I think they thought KV would win at all 3 distances last year and if he would have stayed sound, he would have won the JLT and left BH in the 4 miler?
Mullins definitely said he could compete in an Arkle but Douvan is better and that is believable. I will be really keen to see where he does go because if he was in 'the colours' he'd be a heck of a lot shorter for all 3 targets. Who are the owners? I don't really recognise them. Any chance of them (if they're small) wanting to go for Gold, once in a life time kind of thing?

If Douvan goes CC and Vautour went Ryanair and that got confirmed TODAY, they'd both be odds on... if we knew the Gold Cup horses they certainly wouldn't, so is it safe to assume most of the second strings will (if possible) go for the Gold Cup? (KV, BH, Shaneshill even?)

[Istabraq]

Mullins will decide and I'm convinced KV will only head for Gold if Ricci doesn't have one.
Don't underestimate Rubys role either, he won't want to miss a quality ride so he'll do what he can to convince connections to avoid a clash, and they usually listen to him too....

[Kevloaf]

He will miss a quality ride no matter what. The Ryanair is the most likely chance of Ruby sitting on KV and they would only do that if they had a few going for the Gold Cup...

I think KV will be the perceived second string no matter what race he goes for. I think they have enough ammo to win the Ryanair without needing to aim anything at it.

In my opinion Ruby has the biggest say most of the time. Mullins won't care if he wins the Gold Cup with a Gigginstown horse or a Ricci horse, or Wylie or (KV) ... I'd say KV is most likely to go for Gold Cup at this stage, without Ruby on board...

[gjt7756]

I can see Willie having 3/4 in the gold cup that are genuine, Djakadam, Vatour, Black Hercules and killultagh Vic, and to be quite honest I wouldn't know who I'd want to be on, but if it came down to nailing my colours to one, I think right now it would be black Hercules, think he can rank right up there with the best this season and shouldn't be forgotten, as for the trainers title the latest odds with betfair is Paul Nicholls at 4/5 and Willie Mullins at 6/4, Mullins definitely tempts me and like you said better than any interest rates!!

[Kevloaf]

Interesting odds. Double it up with Idaho this weekend and it is better than investing in property.

I can definitely see Mullins having 3/4 too - Djakadam OR Vautour is a possibility with the other fave for the Ryanair, but Black Hercules, KV and Don Poli should all have a go. Valsuer Lido isn't without a chance based on the Lexus fall.

HOWEVER this is the champion chase thread so I will stop floating off topic...

[gjt7756]

At the end of the day it's the festival and it all rolls into one epic outcome so these threads cross all year round!! Even though I put valseur lido for the GC I completely forgot he was trained by Mullins...!! So yeah Mullins will have 4 as I feel don polo may miss the GC this year and be aimed solely for the grand national, and for the champion chase Douvan is tugging on my heart strings for this one, can't wait to see him saunter past sprinter scare up the hill, then we will know we've seen something special !!