Announcement

Collapse

Fat Jockey Patrons

Fat Jockey is a horse racing community focused on all the big races in the UK and Ireland. We don't charge users but if you have found the site useful then any support towards the running costs is appreciated.
Become a Patron!

You can also make a one-off donation here:
See more
See less

Owner / Trainer Handicap Analysis - 2008 - 2018

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    Originally posted by Hurricane fly View Post
    Slightly misread, could just be one for Giggi

    Interesting all the same...

    Comment


    • #47
      Willie Mullins Handicap Performance 2008 – 2018

      Runners / Winners / Losing Fav / Placed 1-3

      Ultima
      0 / 0 / 0 / 0

      Close Brothers
      4 / 0 / 0 / 1

      Cross Country (Handicap from 2008 – 2015)
      10 / 0 / 1 / 1

      Coral Cup
      26 / 1 / 3 / 1
      2018 - Bleu Berry 20/1

      Fred Winter
      10 / 0 / 0 / 0

      Pertemps
      3 / 0 / 0 / 1

      Brown Advisory
      4 / 0 / 0 / 0

      Kim Muir
      6 / 0 / 0 / 0

      Martin Pipe
      18 / 3 / 2 / 1
      2015 - Killultagh Vic 7/1
      2014 - Don Poli 12/1
      2011 - Sir Des Champs 9/2f

      County Hurdle
      27 / 4 / 1 / 3
      2017 - Arctic Fire 20/1
      2015 - Wicklow Brave 25/1
      2011 - Final Approach 10/1
      2010 - Thousand Stars 20/1

      Grand Annual
      4 / 0 / 1 / 0

      Summary

      Total Handicap Runners: 112
      Winners: 8 (7%)
      Placed: 8 (7.6%)


      A £10 level stake across all his handicap runners from 2008-2018 would leave you up +£145

      Season / Cheltenham Winners / Handicap Entries / Total NH Runners (Ireland only)

      2018 – 1 – 17 - 797
      2017 – 1 – 10 - 571
      2016 – 0 – 14 - 557
      2015 – 2 – 18 - 554
      2014 – 1 – 13 - 665
      2013 – 0 – 15 - 595
      2012 – 0 – 6 - 498
      2011 – 2 – 7 - 467
      2010 – 1 – 10 - 545
      2009 – 0 – 1 - 514
      2008 – 0 – 0 - 562

      Races

      Never sent a horse to the Ultima. 22 (20%) of his horses have run in the Close Brothers, Pertemps, Brown Advisory, Kim Muir and Grand Annual. He has never won those 6 races, or the Fred Winter and Cross Country.

      He has sent 42 horses to 8/11 handicaps, all of which he has never won.

      71 (63%) of all Willies runners go to the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle. 100% of all his handicap winners have come from these races.

      A £10 level stake across all his handicap runners in the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle from 2008-2018 would leave you up +£555

      P Townend is his most successful handicap jockey having won twice and been third twice.

      Average priced winner is 14/1. He has 1 winning favourite, 8 losing favourites.

      Conclusion

      The 2 things that surprised me were the number of handicappers he has sent to the festival (lower than I thought) and how clearly he targets specific races.

      I thought 83% of Paul Nicholls winners coming from 4 races (Fred Winter, Martin Pipe, County Hurdle, Grand Annual) was a stand out stat, but 100% of Willie Mullins handicap winners over the last decade have come from the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle.

      With an average SP of 14/1 you would be in the gravy backing his horses off level stakes in just these 3 races. I would be weary with the Coral Cup but his performance in the Martin Pipe & County Hurdle are exceptional.

      Comment


      • #48
        So unless running in novice or championship races avoid Mullins chasers...

        Comment


        • #49
          Nice one Charlie. On percentage call the County and the Martin Pipe are clear standouts for him for placed horses or better, so I will be taking a keen interest in them 2 races this festival for him. Maybe a few cross doubles on his runners too, especially at the prices he seems to hit a winner at too.

          Comment


          • #50
            Charlie - thank you - hopeful we can all make this pay.

            Comment


            • #51
              And if not, we know where you live...

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by Innoko View Post
                And if not, we know where you live...
                Hahahaha

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Istabraq View Post
                  So unless running in novice or championship races avoid Mullins chasers...
                  I think I'm right in saying he's never had a hcap chase winner .

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by charlie View Post
                    Willie Mullins Handicap Performance 2008 – 2018

                    Runners / Winners / Losing Fav / Placed 1-3

                    Ultima
                    0 / 0 / 0 / 0

                    Close Brothers
                    4 / 0 / 0 / 1

                    Cross Country (Handicap from 2008 – 2015)
                    10 / 0 / 1 / 1

                    Coral Cup
                    26 / 1 / 3 / 1
                    2018 - Bleu Berry 20/1

                    Fred Winter
                    10 / 0 / 0 / 0

                    Pertemps
                    3 / 0 / 0 / 1

                    Brown Advisory
                    4 / 0 / 0 / 0

                    Kim Muir
                    6 / 0 / 0 / 0

                    Martin Pipe
                    18 / 3 / 2 / 1
                    2015 - Killultagh Vic 7/1
                    2014 - Don Poli 12/1
                    2011 - Sir Des Champs 9/2f

                    County Hurdle
                    27 / 4 / 1 / 3
                    2017 - Arctic Fire 20/1
                    2015 - Wicklow Brave 25/1
                    2011 - Final Approach 10/1
                    2010 - Thousand Stars 20/1

                    Grand Annual
                    4 / 0 / 1 / 0

                    Summary

                    Total Handicap Runners: 112
                    Winners: 8 (7%)
                    Placed: 8 (7.6%)


                    A £10 level stake across all his handicap runners from 2008-2018 would leave you up +£145

                    Season / Cheltenham Winners / Handicap Entries / Total NH Runners (Ireland only)

                    2018 – 1 – 17 - 797
                    2017 – 1 – 10 - 571
                    2016 – 0 – 14 - 557
                    2015 – 2 – 18 - 554
                    2014 – 1 – 13 - 665
                    2013 – 0 – 15 - 595
                    2012 – 0 – 6 - 498
                    2011 – 2 – 7 - 467
                    2010 – 1 – 10 - 545
                    2009 – 0 – 1 - 514
                    2008 – 0 – 0 - 562

                    Races

                    Never sent a horse to the Ultima. 22 (20%) of his horses have run in the Close Brothers, Pertemps, Brown Advisory, Kim Muir and Grand Annual. He has never won those 6 races, or the Fred Winter and Cross Country.

                    He has sent 42 horses to 8/11 handicaps, all of which he has never won.

                    71 (63%) of all Willies runners go to the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle. 100% of all his handicap winners have come from these races.

                    A £10 level stake across all his handicap runners in the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle from 2008-2018 would leave you up +£555

                    P Townend is his most successful handicap jockey having won twice and been third twice.

                    Average priced winner is 14/1. He has 1 winning favourite, 8 losing favourites.

                    Conclusion

                    The 2 things that surprised me were the number of handicappers he has sent to the festival (lower than I thought) and how clearly he targets specific races.

                    I thought 83% of Paul Nicholls winners coming from 4 races (Fred Winter, Martin Pipe, County Hurdle, Grand Annual) was a stand out stat, but 100% of Willie Mullins handicap winners over the last decade have come from the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle.

                    With an average SP of 14/1 you would be in the gravy backing his horses off level stakes in just these 3 races. I would be weary with the Coral Cup but his performance in the Martin Pipe & County Hurdle are exceptional.
                    Many Irish hurdlers are given lenient marks particularly those who have had just 3/4 runs. The win to runners ratio of Irish hurdlers is far too high so our UK handicapper has some work to do. It's not a level playing field.

                    The UK handicapper has a far better handle on Irish chasers bar some novices (EG - The Storyteller) who have run in Graded races and have got a mark against the best of the Irish.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Davy Russell Handicap Performance 2008 – 2018

                      The owner & trainer analysis has been so well received I thought I would look at Davy Russell’s handicap performance over the last decade.

                      In short, the man is a genius in handicaps around Cheltenham and would probably be the first person to credit the trainers and owners for giving him the opportunity. The numbers do the talking, no more need be said.

                      Year / Position / Horse / Price / Trainer

                      Wins in bold
                      Placed 2-4 in italics

                      Ultima
                      2017 / 3rd / Noble Endeavor / 15/2 / G Elliott
                      2016 / 4th / Morning Assembly / 10/1 / P A Fahy
                      2014 / F / Vintage Star / 16/1 / Mrs S J Smith
                      2009 / 14th / Cailin Alainn / 13/2 / C Byrnes
                      2008 / 2nd / New Alco / 10/1 / Ferdy Murphy

                      Close Brothers
                      2018 / PU / De Plotting Shed / 11/2 / G Elliott
                      2017 / 3rd / Two Taffs / 7/1 / D Skelton
                      2013 / PU / Carlito Brigante / 8/1 / G Elliott
                      2012 / 15th / Going Wrong / 9/1 / Ferdy Murphy
                      2011 / 6th / Tharawaat / 14/1 / G Elliott
                      2009 / 9th / Slash And Burn / 20/1 / C F Swan
                      2008 / 10th / Lord Ryeford / 20/1 / T R George

                      Cross Country (Handicap from 2008 – 2015)
                      2015 / 1st / Rivage D'Or / 16/1 / A J Martin
                      2011 / RO / One Cool Cookie / 16/1 / C F Swan
                      2010 / 13th / Preists Leap / 33/1 / T G O'Leary
                      2009 / 5th / Dix Villez / 8/1 / P Nolan
                      2008 / 2nd / Native Jack / 40/1 / P J Rothwell

                      Coral Cup
                      2018 / PU / Diamond King / 33/1 / G Elliott
                      2016 / 1st / Diamond King / 12/1 / G Elliott
                      2014 / PU / Party Rock / 28/1 / Jennie Candlish
                      2013 / F / Un Beau Matin / 16/1 / G Elliott
                      2012 / PU / Carlito Brigante / 16/1 / G Elliott
                      2011 / 1st / Carlito Brigante / 16/1 / G Elliott
                      2010 / 13th / Psycho / 7/1 / A J Martin
                      2009 / 1st / Naiad du Misselot / 7/1 / Ferdy Murphy
                      2008 / 10th / Ross River / 14/1 / A J Martin

                      Fred Winter
                      2017 / 10th / Long Call / 9/1 / A J Martin

                      Pertemps
                      2018 / 1st / Delta Work / 6/1 / G Elliott
                      2017 / 1st / Presenting Percy / 11/1 / P G Kelly
                      2016 / 1st / Mall Dini / 14/1 / P G Kelly
                      2013 / 8th / Stonemaster / 14/1 / D T Hughes
                      2010 / PU / Time Electric / 16/1 / T Mullins

                      Brown Advisory
                      2018 / 1st / The Storyteller / 5/1f / G Elliott
                      2017 / PU / Diamond King / 5/1f / G Elliott
                      2010 / PU / Made In Taipan / 25/1 / T Mullins
                      2009 / 3rd / Notable D'Estruval / 8/1 / A L T Moore

                      County Hurdle
                      2018 / 11th / Ben Dundee / 12/1 / G Elliott
                      2015 / 18th / Rich Coast / 25/1 / N Meade
                      2011 / 21st / Grey Soldier / 14/1 / G Elliott
                      2010 / 18th / Bahrain Storm / 33/1 / P J Flynn
                      2008 / 13th / Eagle's Pass / 16/1 / T J O'Mara

                      Grand Annual
                      2018 / 3rd / Top Gamble / 8/1 / Kerry Lee
                      2017 / 4th / Dandridge / 13/2 / A L T Moore
                      2016 / 2nd / Dandridge / 8/1 / A L T Moore
                      2014 / 1st / Savello / 16/1 / A J Martin
                      2009 / 5th / Tiger Cry / 14/1 / A L T Moore
                      2008 / 1st / Tiger Cry / 15/2 / A L T Moore

                      Overall Summary

                      Total Rides: 47
                      Wins: 10 (21%)

                      2nds: 3 (6%)
                      3rds: 4 (8%)
                      4ths: 2 (4%)

                      A £10 level stake across all his handicap runners from 2008-2018 would leave you up +£735.

                      Assuming you are paid 1-4 on a place, Davy has won or placed in 17/47 handicaps at Cheltenham, a strike rate of 40%.

                      The average SP of Davy’s winner’s is 10/1.

                      He has lost on 1 favourite in 47 rides (Diamond King, Brown Advisory 2017)

                      Race Summary

                      His best strike rates are in the Pertemps 3/5, and Coral Cup 3/9
                      Never finished outside the top 5 in the Grand Annual.
                      Never finished inside the top 10 in the County Hurdle
                      Placed 1/7 in Close Brothers
                      He has placed in 3/5 Ultima’s

                      Trainer Summary

                      His record for Pat Kelly is 2/2
                      His record for Arthur Moore from 5 runs is 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th.
                      His record for A J Martin 2 wins from 5 runs. Rivage D’or & Savello
                      He has won 4 times for Gordon from 14 rides

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Fantastic Charlie.

                        All aboard the Davy Russell handicap boat.....

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Charlie - this is stunning stuff.

                          Question for everyone really - as someone who does some natty analysis at work I'd love to take stuff like this on but I find data collection is incredibly manual. What sources do people use?

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            I've already identified backing Gordon & Willie handicap hurdle runners as a possible betting strategy so it's gratifying to see Charlie's hard work (thank you) tending to support it.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              In summary, I'd like to present Charlie's Guide to Handicap Betting at Cheltenham:

                              1) Bet on Davy Russell
                              2) Bet on Gigginstown, especially on the Martin Pipe and Brown Advisory
                              3) Bet on Mullins in the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle. Look out for Paul Townend
                              4) Bet on Paul Nicholls in the Fred Winter, Martin Pipe, County Hurdle and Grand Annual
                              5) Avoid Nicky Henderson (especially with his current focus being BVD and Altior)
                              6) David Pipe is adequate each-way
                              7) Avoid Jonjo O'Neill, especially as he tends to attract a fair bit of money

                              Probably more to come!

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by PadstheFish View Post
                                In summary, I'd like to present Charlie's Guide to Handicap Betting at Cheltenham:

                                1) Bet on Davy Russell
                                2) Bet on Gigginstown, especially on the Martin Pipe and Brown Advisory
                                3) Bet on Mullins in the Coral Cup, Martin Pipe and County Hurdle. Look out for Paul Townend
                                4) Bet on Paul Nicholls in the Fred Winter, Martin Pipe, County Hurdle and Grand Annual
                                5) Avoid Nicky Henderson (especially with his current focus being BVD and Altior)
                                6) David Pipe is adequate each-way
                                7) Avoid Jonjo O'Neill, especially as he tends to attract a fair bit of money

                                Probably more to come!
                                Good summary,
                                remember this for next year so that it saves charlie a bit of time.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X